Lotus Europa Community
Lotus Europa Forums => Garage => Topic started by: andy harwood on Sunday,October 30, 2016, 03:22:30 PM
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Just back from vacation, had some parts waiting.
Thanks to Serge's how-to video, and Allan's mounts, started on new engine mounts today.
First coat of POR drying now.
Frame has been sand blasted, and bottom sides have 1st coat of POR.
Progress!
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Glad you're back from vacation. Now get to work. Some of us want to see that car in Birmingham next year! :)
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Nice to see the mounts being put to good use and they look so clean lol. This is why I never throw anything away. Are you going to mount a spherical bearing inside? Love to see the finished product. Good luck on your project and welcome home, Allan
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Using a sawzall, to cut off the bonded rubber, and a wire wheel does wonders for looks!
Allan, I used the same urethane type bushing that Serge used in his S1 resto.
Mounts are painted in gloss black POR.
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This has got me thinking, I wrecked one of my motor mounts while putting the engine in the chassis and I do have some poly bushings with a 1/2" ID crush tube. Are there any cars currently running using this set-up? I'm curious about how harsh the poly bushings are compared to the compliant rubber mounts.
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After breaking the OEM mounts, I welded up a set for myself several years ago and they are still going strong. I don't think you will find the vibrations/feedback problematic.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/2IOWX635cd5ZcEy3jsA91-cIaZrmM4aym2adzIQnr4lohN-S8Cc6wzQPE-rDrxHdZjUiP4B87KVQiA=w1366-h768-no)
Dean
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Well, a little snag. So, question time.
Purchased NG3 from Banks, along with a transaxle mounting kit.
Richard assured me that with a frame with the 365 loop transaxle, using the mounting kit, I would not need to modify the rear frame loop.
Have Lotus TC engine bolted up to bell housing/NG3, placed loosely in frame to fit the transaxle mounts. Doesn't look like it will go.
Anyone have opinion, or words of wisdom?
Didn't really want to cut the frame loop off, or mod it, but is no problem if I have to.
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Which side of the engine mount bracket is attached to the engine mount? Having the bracket in front gives a bit more room. Are the mounts stock? Or what you have been making up above?
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I had a 365 before I converted to an NG3. I called Richard and told him that it didn't look like it was going to fit with the rear hoop I had (the NG3 seems to protrude further than the 365) so he sent me a rear hoop to use in place of the 365 hoop. The hoop Richard sent me was bent to go under the tranny and my fabricator had to weld in some tubes in the hoop to pick up the tranny mounts. It looked similar to the hoop and may have actually been for a 335 but there were no mounting ears on it.
Since the NG3 is a bit longer, I'm not sure how it could work with the 365 rear hoop - but I wouldn't want to say there is no way it could work since it's been a long time since I dealt with it. It would definitely be worth a call to him to straighten that out.
I've attached a picture of the three hoops from the TC parts manual. The #10 is for the 365, the #9 is for the 352 and the #8 is for the 335. Check out the TC parts manual in the Chassis section.
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The engine brackets are on the rear side of the frame mounts. Yes, using the frame side mounts I modified, but the mounting tabs on modified mounts are in the same location as on stock mounts.
The engine/transaxle assembly may slide forward 1/2 inch or so, but appears need about 3 inches for transaxle rear cover to clear frame hoop.
My idea was to mate NG3 to TC engine, place in frame, locate transaxle mounts, then mate NG3 to Zetec, repeat process, and make engine to frame mounts.
Piece of cake, I thought.
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BDA, I specifically asked Richard when purchasing the NG3 about fitment, that's when he suggested using his mounting kit (is bolted to transaxle rear cover in pic). I quizzed him then, remembering that you had to replace your hoop. He said NG3 would fit with 365 rear frame loop.
Very recent follow up call, I posed the question again, telling him my plan - attach TC engine to NG3 to locate the mounts, and then attach Zetec to NG3 to make engine mounts, His response was that would be the way that he would go about it, but they had never installed a Zetec longitudinally.
So, I'm thinking it must fit, If Richard says so. but seems every thing I've read/seen uses a different method to mount the transaxle.
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I certainly wouldn't disagree with anything Richard would say about this, or any topic about Europas for that matter. I wouldn't be surprised if he came up with a mount solution since I got my NG3 from him (in 1998 or 1999). Just for the record, I used the stock motor mounts.
I wish he had that mount set up when I did mine!
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Thanks John and BDA for your input.
The photo I posted, due to angles of frame, engine on hoist, and camera, is not a good representation of actual fitment.
Sorry.
I called Richard at Banks this morning. His response was "may have to hit loop with a hammer, or may have to modify/replace loop. Depends on the frame". Also, "measurements can be up to 1/2 inch off, up-down".
So, after some careful rechecking this morning, it appears that I'm within Richard's guidelines.
After looking at my spreadsheet on my Europa costs, An Elise isn't looking that expensive. And they have air con.
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After looking at my spreadsheet on my Europa costs, An Elise isn't looking that expensive. And they have air con
Yeah, but how different is your Elise from any other Elise? Your Europa will be made just for you! ;D
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" Yeah, but how different is your Elise from any other Elise? Your Europa will be made just for you! "
One Day!
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It never really hit me until the body shop screwed up. Faced with another 20K$cdn to put the body right, I realized I could have bought two (2) Elises for what I have into the Europa. Most days, I don't care because I love the Europa but, some days...
Please be very careful when you are fitting the powertrain. The transaxle has to be centred EXACTLY in the frame as it locates the rear suspension.
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Which side of the engine mount bracket is attached to the engine mount? Having the bracket in front gives a bit more room. Are the mounts stock? Or what you have been making up above?
Since the transaxle/engine only need to move forward a small amount for transaxle rear cover to clear the frame hoop, I tried putting the engine mounts in front of the frame mounts. It didn't want to fit due to the angle of the frame decreasing. I used a set of used mounts (Thanks Allan!), took a end mill and removed rubber from the front side of mount, to accommodate the engine mounts. The bolt holes didn't line up, but I got the mounts at the correct height, and clamped them together. This gave enough clearance for the transaxle rear cover to clear frame hoop. Total amount assembly moved forwards is 5/8th inch.
Is this too far forward for the intended CV jointed axles? It appears the engine will be in about the same position as the TC engine, as the Zetec is a tad shorter block.
"Please be very careful when you are fitting the powertrain. The transaxle has to be centred EXACTLY in the frame as it locates the rear suspension."
I have the transaxle center line centered, measuring to frame edge, both sides, from bell housing to rear of transaxle.
The photo shows some angle iron I have attached to the frame, and bolted to the alternator mounting hole in the bell housing.
My thinking is, with the rear transaxle mount, and the jig attached to the bell housing, I'll have the transaxle/bell housing in the correct position, so can attach the Zetec and make the engine mounts.
Thought I'd try to get some input before I welded the jig. So, I'm really open to suggestions and comments.
Second photo is the transaxle mounting bolts and bushings from Banks. The plates are on the transaxle. Bushings appear to be front suspension bushings?
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On mine I made my own hoop and fit the "spacers" into the hoop:
http://s250.photobucket.com/user/jbcollier/media/Europa%20cable%20shifter/IMG_0594.jpg.html?sort=2&o=0
(photo bucket is a pop-up nightmare, sorry, but I don't want to break links in my old messages)
That brings the transaxle a bit further back.
Yup, the mounts are a-arm bushings. Needless to say, you can "feel" the engine when it's running. Sweet diddly for flex under load though, which is nice.
John
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Thanks for the input John.
I think moving the loop is the better option, I just didn't want to cut the frame if I didn't have to. Now that I have some solid transaxle mounting points to refer to, I'll investigate how much room I have to move the loop rearwards.
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John, that's very similar to how I mounted my NG3. Mine didn't use the A-arm bushings, though.
Andy, from the picture, it looks like you'll be able to fit it with the 365 hoop. Richard seems to have set you up with a nice mount situation. I will say that it looks like an advantage to John and my setup is that you can take off the end cover but it might be difficult with the 365 hoop.
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After looking and measuring, and speaking with Richard today, I've decided to leave the frame loop as is, and shift engine/tranny forward a bit.
Hoping I don't regret it in the future.
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Andy,
When I installed the Zetec with the new NG box I first assembled the TC engine with the original 365 gearbox and put it into the chassis. Then I marked the location of the engine and tranny flange on the frame. I then put the Zetec with the NG box in the chassis and placed it in exactly the same location using that reference point or plain where the original engine was located. Then I centered the engine and leveled it in place. At that point I built new motor mounts from the engine to the stock mounts in the chassis. I then took Richard's mounting kit for the NG box and drilled new hole in the original rear hoop and welded them. I then modified the rear hoop to accept the NG box.
(http://www.lotuseuropa.org/gallery/albums/album13/RearHoop_1.jpg)
(http://www.lotuseuropa.org/gallery/albums/album13/RearHoop_2.jpg)
The only modification I made to the chassis was a small notch on the right side to accommodate the alternator.
(http://www.lotuseuropa.org/gallery/albums/album13/Frame_mods_alternator.jpg)
Here is the result when I test fitted the body on the chassis. Plenty of clearance.
(http://www.lotuseuropa.org/gallery/albums/album13/Body_on_01.sized.jpg)
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Thanks for the photos and information Joe.
Cut a bit out of the hoop, and welded some 3/8ths flat back in this afternoon. Just roughly lining transaxle/engine up, *appears* to have hoop clearance & correct position.
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Test fit of the VW Axle/CV joints.
Didn't have time to look closely, but here is a pic.
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Thanks to information shared here, this is how I modified my frame loop. I notched it, then welded in 3/16th flat. Bent it in a bit on top. Thanks Joe & John. Transaxle output shafts are in original location.
Some observations on the test fit of the VW axles, CV joints, and stub axles.
As pictured, the transaxle flanges came from Banks, are 100 mm, and use a type 2 VW CV joint. The axles are from a VW beetle, and are type 1 CV joints (84mm). The stub axles are from a VW beetle, and are a type 1 CV joint. Stub axle spacers are VW, being ground to dimensions used by Trimandaran (sp?).
-Everything lines up nicely, and is about the same dimensions as Lotus.
-Type 2 CV joint will not allow axle circlip to be installed as race is too wide, about 2mm.
-Stub axle. From face of VW hub to end of axle is ~2". Measuring from backside of wheel, to inside of the center cap is 1.75". I have Rota wheels, have not measured stock Lotus rims.
Solutions - Inner CV joint race should be able to mill down 2mm, to allow clip to be installed. Empi makes a stub axle that is about 1/2" shorter overall, so that should take care of being able to install a center cap in the wheel. Also, this stub axle uses the type 2 CV joint.
Always open to suggestions!
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That's just a mock up, right? You've still to fit the rubber mount fittings. Mine I set mostly to the rear and I braced them to the plate as well.
http://s250.photobucket.com/user/jbcollier/media/Europa%20cable%20shifter/IMG_0595.jpg.html
(lots of pop ups, sorry, but I don't want to break my old message links)
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Thanks for the input John.
Yes, transaxle mount just mocked up.
I'm making mounts to attach to the sides of transaxle.
My thinking now is to start mocking up the shifter cables/attachment - so I don't have to back track with the transaxle mounts.
What transaxle do you have? The NG3 I bought from Banks appears to shift as yours. The other cable shifter conversions I've found on the web appear to shift from the rear, like the 365 transaxle. The only other documentation is in the following link -
https://www.prevanders.net/europa/ng3.html
Could you share some of how you set up the mechanism?
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Have you thought of retaining the original rod shifter? I kept the original tree, just moved it forward to clear Zetec. Ran rod down left side of engine with a kink welded in it. Used Banks side shifter to left side on the NG3. Works well with very little play.
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Mine is an early 395 -- nice 3.4x first gear, not so nice 0.93 5th -- which looks similar but is smaller, than an NG-3.
Here are some photo links to what I did for the cable shifter:
http://s250.photobucket.com/user/jbcollier/library/Europa%20cable%20shifter?sort=2&page=1
Reverse lock out:
https://jbcollier.smugmug.com/Lotus-Europa/i-nc9PsWm/A
Video in action:
https://jbcollier.smugmug.com/Lotus-Europa/i-4qr8BZx/A
Finished shifter:
https://jbcollier.smugmug.com/Lotus-Europa/i-SKn8D9L/A
I used a cable shifter out of a Toyota Corolla which I stripped and manufactured my own mounts. I made a simple pivot and links using a 2:1 ratio for the selector (in and out) and straight on for the shifter (back and forth). Had custom shift cables made up at a big rig shop.
Mounting to the frame inside the "Y":
https://jbcollier.smugmug.com/Lotus-Europa/i-zTW9WSt/A
Routing and bracket, shifter:
https://jbcollier.smugmug.com/Lotus-Europa/i-TqVnpGg/A
https://jbcollier.smugmug.com/Lotus-Europa/i-cz6kRRX/A
... rail selector:
https://jbcollier.smugmug.com/Lotus-Europa/i-65jJJg7/A
https://jbcollier.smugmug.com/Lotus-Europa/i-2TVMXbB/A
Used hose swivel fittings at the shifter:
https://jbcollier.smugmug.com/Lotus-Europa/i-PBZg2MS/A
Required a wee bit of head scratching but was all well within my albeit limited mental capabilities. Works really, really well: shifts like a dream and no problem finding and selecting all the gears.
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"all well within my albeit limited mental capabilities"
Somehow, I have this mental picture of you, blindfolded, one hand tied behind your back - just to make it sporting - fabricating this shifter mechanism from scratch.
Thanks John for the information and pictures. Off to start looking, thinking, and measuring.
"Have you thought of retaining the original rod shifter?"
The cable shifter seemed appealing when I started think about this conversion, so that is what I've been focusing on.
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Small update.
Received new axles, stub axles, and 2 100mm VW bus CV joints.
New axles are stock 15 1/4 long, have about 2 inches of splines, permitting use of either type 1 or 2 CV joint
Axles installed have about 3/8th in. end play at full axle droop, and have end play when level, so not in a bind there.
New stub axles for Bus type CV joint fit. being shorter it appears end of stub axle will not protrude past wheel center cap.
Hubs in photo are type 3, I turned the diameter down enough to fit the Honda rotors, and turned in a seating ring for the rotor.
Will play around with spacers to back space stub axle to have enough room for lower link bracket. It appears the stub axle will be the correct length, as there is almost room to insert cotter pin, with axle not being tightened, using 2 spacers on back side.
Appx. parts cost so far, about $750-800. not including parts purchased but not used, lol
2nd photo shows with short spacer, 3rd w/ full spacer.
Thanks to a post on the yahoo group today about problems installing a NG3 with Banks twin link kit, I saw where I've been wrong in measuring this.
Lower links - I was thinking of using 6061 aluminum 7/8" rod for the link body and 1/2"heim joints - good, bad, so-so?
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That looks nice! I would have preferred to have two CV joints rather than a U-joint and a CV joint which is how Richard's twin link rear suspension was set up back when I go it. But I can't say I could tell the difference.
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Thanks BDA.
Reading my posts, I'm sure most realize I'm learning as I go on this project. Reading a post on the YH group yesterday, made me realize something I hadn't thought about - that the output shaft width is different between a 365 & NG3 transaxle. I had not thought about that.
After quizzing some real machinists, I think I will scrap the type 3 hubs that I turned down. Reason being because of existing lug holes and the way the back side of hub is cast, it will put new lugs between the webs cast in the back, which is a thinner part of the hub.
I had ordered 2 blank rear rotors, but the hat of the rotor is so tall, it appears to be unusable. Was going to send them back, but with return shipping, well... thought I was going to have some door stops.
So, today I will look into cutting the rotor off and using the center hub.
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Custom work is always like this. My problem is that I think best with my hands. Some people can "prototype" in their heads. Not me, I work and rework pieces to fit and solve my issues and then I remake them again in a cleaner, more elegant design. The cast-off bin can fill rather quickly some days.
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Custom work is always like this. My problem is that I think best with my hands. Some people can "prototype" in their heads. Not me, I work and rework pieces to fit and solve my issues and then I remake them again in a cleaner, more elegant design. The cast-off bin can fill rather quickly some days.
I'd hate to say how much time I spent on the first set of engine mounts, and then chunked them. If I had hired me to do this job, I would have fired myself before lunch on the first day.
Out to look at brake rotors and scratch my head a bit!
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Andy, keep us posted on the type 3 hubs. That's been my stumbling block. Cast hub looks too thin as you say. Jamar makes hubs that look like they could be redrilled. ISP West also has type 3, occasionally blank, but pricey.
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Today's playtime.
Undrilled VW IRS rear disc hub.
The hat depth (3") seemed to make it undesirable to use for the conversion.
Splines are 2" deep, Lotus hub splines are about 1 3/4" deep, and VW type 3 hub about 2.25" (from memory, so beware)
So today, I kinda made more than one piece out of a one piece rotor.
Anyhows,
German mfg. type 3 hub thickness, between the webs - .4
Brazil mfg. type 3 hub thickness, between the casting webs - .390
EMPI VW beetle rear hub, disc thickness - .545
I just skimmed the back side to smooth it up. It is not turned down to correct diameter.
These hubs were about $80.ea, shipped. (you don't want to return, priced mailing via USPS was $75. only reason I still had them. Even I get lucky on occasion!)
It appears having shorter splines, will offer more options in spacing, will investigate tomorrow. Wifey has told me I had enough fun for today.
Pics show rotor/hub, and cut off hub, photographed from back side.
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Hi Andy,
If you're looking for discs for the conversion, perhaps these two pdf files will help. They don't show every detail such as bolt spacing and hole arrangements but they do have the basics of diameter, thickness and top hat heights. I've split into 2 parts because the complete file is slightly over the 1mb limit.
I used this file and a UK website when searching for discs. http://brakeparts.co.uk/#!/shop (http://brakeparts.co.uk/#!/shop)
The website was good because not only were they one of the cheapest around over here (yeah, cheapskate, I know :) ) but they also have pictures of the disc with hole dimensions in most cases.
Keep posting, although I'm not contributing this is a really interesting thread and the learning curve you're on is going to be great for those that follow.
Brian
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Thanks Brian.
When I started this, it was going to be rebuilding the TC engine and adding rear disc brakes. I don't know how I got to where I am today!
The plans on the YH group are the ones I have been following, using Miata calipers, Honda rotors that have been turned down in diameter and redrilled for bolt spacing.
I'll look at the files, as you can see - I'm not afraid to buy parts, modify, then not use.
Speaking of braking -
The Lotus hub has a 'centering ring' (I don't know the correct term) for the brake drum to center on, even though it also centers on the wheel stud shoulder. In the photo, Lotus hub on left, VW type 3 hubs, center and right. The VW hubs had a centering ring, a larger diameter that had to be turned down for the Honda rotor to fit hub.
I guess my question is - is this 'centering ring' machined into the hub necessary? The rotor will center on the wheel stud shoulders anyhows, and machining the hub face down will reduce the thickness of the hub.
Also found that the center mount for the lower links, modified by Banks when purchasing the NG3 will not allow the lower link bolts to be completely inserted as the 1/2" hole is about 1/4" out of alignment. Appears it will be as easy to make another as to modify this one.
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SwiftDB4, Can you tell me or do you have photos of this? Is it the stock mechanism, or a modified one for the NG3?
"Used Banks side shifter to left side on the NG3. Works well with very little play."
Thanking you in advance
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I guess my question is - is this 'centering ring' machined into the hub necessary
I would think not. I think the centering is required for drum brakes because centering on wheel studs would not be accurate enough. If the drum is even a little off, you would have a problem with vibration, but if a brake disc is off a little, it won't matter.
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Unless the rotor/drum is being held on by a tapered fitting, thus guaranteeing centring, keep the centring ring. Small amounts of run out may make wheel balancing a nightmare.
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I guess my question is - is this 'centering ring' machined into the hub necessary? The rotor will center on the wheel stud shoulders anyhows, and machining the hub face down will reduce the thickness of the hub.
I think I'm with BDA and the centering ring is more to do with drums and getting the shoes aligned. As for imbalance I think it's down to how accurately you measure and for anyone who is confident and capable of doing this sort of conversion my personal take is that you'll be fine.
My first set of rear discs were MGF 240mm ones which had a centre bore of 66mm, a very sloppy fit but it aligned itself on the studs because it has exactly the same PCD as the Lotus. With the disc alone bolted on (no wheel) and a dial gauge resting on the edges & sides I can't say I noticed any significant movement, a the needle moved up and down but nothing that made me worry. Admittedly I was more concerned with run-out than centering, but deflection was minor all round. I can't remember what it was but I was aiming at 0.004" total run-out and it didn't get close. And more to the point. there didn't seem to be any wheel balance problems either.
The second set of discs were Mini rear, 259mm and a 64mm centre bore. This was a much neater fit and like the MGF discs showed minimal run-out and no balance problems.
In conclusion I don't think you need a centering boss but you do need some accuracy in hole drilling ! If you're 1 or 2mm out then I would be cautious but presumably you'll be marking the honda (or whatever) discs better than that.
Brian
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SwiftDB4, Can you tell me or do you have photos of this? Is it the stock mechanism, or a modified one for the NG3?
"Used Banks side shifter to left side on the NG3. Works well with very little play."
Thanking you in advance
I bought this from Banks 10 years ago to change NG3 shifter to left side, assume he still sells this?
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Thanks Swift.
I got the crank with my NG3, it was laying loose in the box, not welded to the shaft. Gotta do some more research on this.
On another note in this journey - and you'll probably like this -
I unboxed the 2nd disc rotor to cut the hat off, and it's a bit of 'same same but different' than the first.
(I never really understood the "same same, but different" bit in Thailand, but it seemed to fit here)
Guess I should have looked at both discs in the beginning, didn't, but that's just how I roll.
Anyhows -
2nd rotor thickness -
between the casting webs - .580
web - . 830!
So, Swift, we were both looking for more metal in the hub, there it is!
These came from Chirco. (pic is backside of both rotors)
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Thanks on the hub thickness. Only question I have is it would be necessary to cut the outer face of what you have cut down to allow for a separate rotor? Which would be about .250"? Still enough thickness if you can drill in the webs for studs, but not outside the webs?
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swift-
Pics are of a Type 1 stub axle beside the shorter stub axle for type 2 CV. you can see the difference. Other pic is the type 2 short stub axle, with 2 stock thickness VW spacers, and a PVC center spacer. Measurement I got on the stock Lotus setup, inside bearing shoulder to hub face was 4.85. Measurement on the VW mockup pictured was 4.93. Oh- The threaded holes, for the VW lug bolts are in the web and are .5 deep.
YMMV on any measurements!
In the posts on the YH group, re: fitting banks twin link, Richard H moved everything out the 12mm difference of the NG3 to no ill effect.
As far as machining the outer face of the hub to accommodate the thickness of the rotor - it 'appears' by varying the thickness of the stub axle spacers, you should be able to put the face of the hub in the position you want.
I finished cutting the 2nd type 3 disc rotor down enough so I could measure the thickness between the webs, which is about .58
So, my aim is to go to NAPA, see what 12mm wheel studs are available with enough shank for the thickness of the hub. Hoping able to get studs with enough shank to be able to drill the 3/4" web, with a spot milled for stud to seat flush. Once I have those, can decide exactly how to proceed with the hub machining and placement of upper link & disc brake bracket.
From the thread on the YH group, you already have a 4 link rear suspension, do you have rear disc brake also? If so, I understand the importance of the hubs final position. I have a couple sets of caliper brackets, but don't know if I'll end up being able to use them, have to wait and see
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slight update.
transaxle mounts fitted and welded.
ended up using some superflex poly bushings.
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That's coming along really nicely, Andy!
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If you went off the ears on the plate sandwiched between the rear cover and the main casings, it would be a lot stiffer.
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:I-agree:
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If you went off the ears on the plate sandwiched between the rear cover and the main casings, it would be a lot stiffer.
I knew this was going to be the response. A trip was planned to the sheet metal shop today anyhows, lol.
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Well I'll be damned, you did expect the Spanish Inquisition!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WJXHY2OXGE
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Yes, I did expect bad reviews. The idea sounded good in my head, but with all the voices in there...
At least I didn't get the rack. And I've never been a Lumberjack, lol.
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After dodging the inquisition rack by the proverbial hair, thought I'd post a couple photos.
Since I've the Banks NG3 mounting kit, and some poly bushings - plus, wanting to keep frame modifications to a minimum, this is what I've come up with as a transaxle mount. Just have the cross bar and left side mocked up and tack welded so far.
Intending to use the Banks mounts kind of as intended - but they will just serve to limit any fore/aft movement, due to distance from rear hoop. Any torsional movement will be transmitted to the poly bushings in the crossbar.
As long as I don't have to endure the rack, or sing the lumberjack song, I'd really appreciate input/ opinions on this setup.
Also, in 2nd pic, you can see the shock mount/crossbar that I made. Has a bit more steel than the original, and the center is removable.
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That looks great Andy! It looks like you wouldn't need the Banks style mounting - and your adaptation of that is really nice, too! You're pretty far down the road with this so you've probably considered this, but it would be nice if you could design a cross member that did double duty.
I'm really impressed with your designs!
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Hi Andy,
I think your concept is excellent and certainly looks robust enough. My only comment would be about exhaust routing, but that's based entirely on my own car's exhaust as I have no idea how the conversions manage. My exhaust hangs off the gearbox around that point so it would need a re-think for that set-up.
Having said that, a short length of flexible as used on modern cars, and mounting the silencer onto the chassis looks very possible on yours ?
Brian
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Thanks for the approving comments.
BDA, after looking at what others did using a cross brace. and doing away with the rear loop, this is what I came up with. After cutting and fitting everything, I noticed that what you are suggesting may be possible, will give a look see. Thank you for suggesting this - it would
Brian, my car was fitted with a rather small, Flowmaster muffler. I was intending to keep it. By rotating it a bit, and relocating the inlet & outlets, "appears" it will fit. Originally. it was secured to the shock cross member.
I was, and will be using a Ford speedometer sending unit. It fit in the 365 tranxale, but not in the NG3. I've read that some have used a short length of aluminum tubing to adapt. That would have put it conflict with the rear hoop mounting bolts. The mounting section is a press fit, so I removed it, and reduced the diameter and cut a step into it. Then tapped the rear transaxle cover for a 1/4 x 24 bolt to secure the sending unit. It appears one ear on rear cover will need to be trimmed for fitment.
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Andy,
Are you using the Banks shift linkage kit? Is there a chance your solution is going to impinge on your shift rods? I have the same NG conversion using both the Banks rear hoop kit and the shift linkage kit.
(http://www.lotuseuropa.org/gallery/albums/album13/Rear_hoop_1.jpg)
This was my solution to the same problem
(http://www.lotuseuropa.org/gallery/albums/album13/RearHoop_2.jpg)
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Joe,
Thanks for the input.
I really like how you made the center section of the hoop removable, that's nice!.
Banks doesn't do the shift kit any more it seems, at least when I purchased the NG3. I was opting out for a cable shift system anyhows. I'm probably going to copy D. Anderson's method of attaching shifter cables to the rear cover shifter shaft.
After posting the above photos, and BDA's comment about using the shock mount crossbar as a mounting point for the transaxle, I'm looking at that. It appears doable.
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OK, I was just checking. Cable shift should not be an issue. The removable portion of the hoop is stock. I didn't do that.
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I'm intending to make a cable shifter for my conversion. I had purchased on of D. Lindeman's most excellent shifter kits. It really was nice, if you've not seen one. Since I would not be able to use some of the mounts, I decided to sell it, and make my own.
I started with a mid 80s Toyota shifter, ebay, about $30. The crank on this shifter operates above the tunnel, so had to modify that. You can see where the crank was cut, flipped, and re-welded. The cup holding the shifter ball had to be drilled, for the later style, below the tunnel cable attachment.
I purchased a short throw shifter off ebay, about $25. Modified this shifter by cutting off the ball cable attachment at the end, drilling and tapping for a 5/16x24 bolt, as I will try using a rod end there
. Above the ball, the shifter is a bit shorter than the stock Lotus shifter. I cut it off, threaded it for 3/8x24.
I bought some 5/8th rod, drilled and countersunk one end, tapped it for 3/8x24, threaded the other end for 5/16x24, Then turned it to a taper that is near the stock shifter taper. It is about 1" longer than stock, as the whole shifter will set a bit lower in the tunnel. It will be no problem to shorten it if needed. Will either locktite it, or drill & tap for a small set screw so it doesn't come loose.
Now, to make the base, and see if everything will work together.
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Andy. Can't wait till you get to attaching the cables to the NG3 trans. I've got the kit but am not that far. Looking forward to your expertise. Tom
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Tom,
Got no expertise here. D. Andersons or J. Mellelieu's cable conversions are what I will be attempting to copy. I like the simplicity of how D. Anderson attached his cables to the transaxle. It will be a while before I will get around to it.
andyh