65/0038R Restoration process

[JasonH]

BDA  Did you have the engine out when you glassed the firewall?  I want to, but it looks like a very uncomfortable task with the engine in the way.  I am not really feeling all that motivated to do glass work upside down.  Actually I don't know how you did it even with the engine removed!

Andy  Yeah I have just enough of it to do all 4 I have one down now 3 to go.   Buells are cool.  Googling the X1 CK edition.

Today off to hopefully finish the firewall,  do another sill blocker, and fix my mistake on the outer dash supports.  By "mistake" I decided to use NAPA brand poly resin (to build the mounts up) and this stuff just doesn't cure or bond!  I'll take a picture

Another random picture for entertainment purposes: 
These ruffians driving red cars pulled up next to the Europa this summer.  My first thought... "hope I didn't get a door ding!"   

[4129R]

I have always fibreglassed the firewall from the seat side. Much easier.

If the fibreboard is damaged beyond repair, cut 1/2" ply to fit in the odd shaped holes, and fibreglass them in behind the (removed) seats.

[BDA]

Jason, I did a complete body off rebuild of my car so the engine, as well as everything else, was out. I wouldn't even consider doing that with the engine in. As it was, it was pretty messy because of the slope of the firewall. Replacing the firewall from the inside with the engine in seems doable though.

Alex (4129R), I think what I was thinking is that I wanted to get rid of the horsehair insulation and I needed something solid to mount the new insulation on. That and replacing the entire firewall seemed like overkill - it's just as likely that I was intimidated by the prospect. I don't think it was till later that I read about people using marine plywood. I think that is a much better idea than what I did. Luckily, my fiberboard was not in such rough shape that I absolutely had to replace it.

[andy harwood]

The bulkhead on my TCS had been fiberglassed  from the inside when I purchased it.
Appears to have the original horse hair insulation on the engine side.
That will  be changed, "if & when", lol.

The Kevlar/CF, well, just knowing it's there...  And most who'd look in those locations, when they spy what's there will be incredulous -  and the questions will start...
 
Yeah, Buells are way cool. I can find parallels between the thinking of C. Chapman & E. Buell. Shame what happened to the Buell company.

[4129R]

On the engine side on TCS, there is the noise deadening underfelt, dressed right down where the fuel tanks are, and a sort of black linoleum type waterproof material, again full width and down into the tank wells.

I glue both, and then screw into the fibreboard or ply with self tapping screws and big "penny" washers to hold the sound deadening material in place as the glue is not reliable.

[dakazman]

 Hi Jason,
     Looks like you caught the bug and are enjoying your Europa. Driving those winding mountain roads must be fantastic. Looking forward to reading more. Best of luck with your new BFF.
Dakazman

[TonyWa28]

Newish member, so apologize in advance if already covered elsewhere....

I built a firewall using foam core board as typically used in newer boat construction (replaces marine plywood in many applications).  Very lightweight, easily shaped and sanded for fitment.  Built in 3 pieces (as seen in pics).  Once foam shaping is complete and before installing the foam in the car, fiberglass the foam board on the engine side using mat or roving as you see fit.  Then glass the panels into the car directly in the engine bay.  I attached the body to the chassis during installation so as to avoid making a warped body relative to the chassis.   Next glass the cabin side. 

The project went fairly quick and I was pleased with the outcome.   Very stiff and should provide some decent insulation between cabin and engine. Will cover engine side with some suitable thermal/sound deadening material when I get to that point in my rebuild.....maybe lizardskin as I've been wanting to try that out on something. 

4'x8' foam core board was $40 as I recall. 

TonyWa

[BDA]

Nicely done, Tony! That sounds like a better option than plywood!

[JasonH]

Tony
   Did you post these picts elsewhere?  I vaguely remember seeing these,or something like them.
Couple of questions:
 Was the firewall totally disintegrated? 
 How did you apply the glass on the engine bay side? 

Oh... Wait a minute...  You did the panel layup and THEN bonded it in!  Am I correct? 

[gideon]

Tony - where did you buy that panel?  I don't think I've seen a price close to $40 for a 4x8 sandwich panel anywhere.  Jamestown Distributors has them at more than 10x that price.

https://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/show_product.do?pid=1587&familyName=Foam+Core+Composite+Panel

[TonyWa28]

I glassed the engine bay side of the pieces out of the car and the cabin side after installation.  With only the one side glassed I was able to do a little clamping and conforming before permanently attaching the panel and then glassing the cabin side.  Made for a good fit. You still have to do the edge mat taping of the engine bay side, but that is pretty straightforward.   it is messy to do the cabin side vertical part, but if you don't use too much resin, its not bad.  Folks tend to use lots of resin which makes things drippy, heavy and no stronger.  Hope that helps.

First post for my pictures.

Tonywa

[JR73]

Looks like plain closed cell foam sheet in the pics, not a pre made sandwich panel (foam core with composite skins) - this is probably why there is such a price difference in what you are finding?

[TonyWa28]

this is where I got it.  I can't find the price now.

https://fiberglassflorida.com/fiberglass-knit-and-woven-core/air-cell-t-60-6lb-green-foam.html

[JasonH]

Tony  Thanks for posting your method.  This has opened up an impasse that I had to deal with the engine side of the wall.  Much appreciated.

Oh... and some pictures of the engine compartment as I got the car.  I was pretty stoked to see all the vintage stickers on the boot compartment when I first opened the deck lid.

[TonyWa28]

Cool stickers!

yes, the foam core is plain.  You apply resin to the foam and then add mat or woven roving.  You can use a spiked roller to drive the resin farther into the foam to maximize strength if need be, but realistically the original firewall had little strength.  The foam core with two sides glass is much stronger.  At the end of the day the bulk of the strength is in the chassis.