Author Topic: steering rack  (Read 3801 times)

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Offline Richard H

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Re: steering rack
« Reply #30 on: Monday,January 20, 2020, 01:04:05 PM »
Can you tell us some more about how you found this out?

I was chasing down any sources of lost motion in the steering system and one such might have been the adjustment of the pinion backlash with the rack.  Having carefully removed all lost motion bt changing the backup slider shims I ended up with steering that felt smooth and 'right' so I took the car out for a test drive.  Only got as far as the first sharp left hand turn and the steering went very stiff.  I actually went to the trouble of chasing down where on the rack it was binding and set about trying to correct what I thought was a badly machined rack.

At some point in a very tedious process I asked of the lotus-europa.com list if anyone else had found the same.  Somebody then informed me of this standard practice of leaving more metal in the straight ahead position and the penny dropped.  It has since been my plan to try and replicate the TCS rack standard for best operation.

The car had done about 90k miles at this point and the rack was visually perfect, not a sign of wear.

Offline chrisbeck

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Re: steering rack
« Reply #31 on: Monday,January 20, 2020, 01:05:02 PM »
I've just stripped a 2nd. hand 'slow' Triumph rack and it has a 6-tooth pinion as expected. When stripping my original rack I find it has a 7-tooth pinion, not what I expected. A colleague has advised against fitting a quicker rack in the Europa and I'm now confused. I cannot transfer the original 7-tooth pinion because of the angle. Attached photo shows the LHD 7-tooth pinion on the left and the Triumph RHD 6-tooth pinion on the right.
Am I missing something?
Thanks in anticipation,
Chris

Offline BDA

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Re: steering rack
« Reply #32 on: Monday,January 20, 2020, 01:29:39 PM »
Did your colleague explain why you should not use the 6-tooth pinion?

Offline BDA

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Re: steering rack
« Reply #33 on: Monday,January 20, 2020, 01:47:41 PM »
Can you tell us some more about how you found this out?

I was chasing down any sources of lost motion in the steering system and one such might have been the adjustment of the pinion backlash with the rack.  Having carefully removed all lost motion bt changing the backup slider shims I ended up with steering that felt smooth and 'right' so I took the car out for a test drive.  Only got as far as the first sharp left hand turn and the steering went very stiff.  I actually went to the trouble of chasing down where on the rack it was binding and set about trying to correct what I thought was a badly machined rack.

At some point in a very tedious process I asked of the lotus-europa.com list if anyone else had found the same.  Somebody then informed me of this standard practice of leaving more metal in the straight ahead position and the penny dropped.  It has since been my plan to try and replicate the TCS rack standard for best operation.

The car had done about 90k miles at this point and the rack was visually perfect, not a sign of wear.

It sounds like you found what I experienced when I rebuilt my rack. After 90,000 miles, I'm not surprised since my Spitfire rack was supposed to only be 40,000 miles old. That is an indication of the amount of wear induced from driving straight ahead - which makes sense when you think about it you spend much more time driving straight and driving straight requires frequent minute corrections.

If you haven't rebuilt the rack to your satisfaction yet, my advice is to get your pinion as tight as you can WITHOUT feeling the individual teeth throughout the travel of the rack. It will be little looser than the spec calls for at the straight ahead position, but you don't have a choice.

Offline chrisbeck

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Re: steering rack
« Reply #34 on: Monday,January 20, 2020, 02:16:25 PM »
Did your colleague explain why you should not use the 6-tooth pinion?
He fitted a refurbished 'quick' rack (7-teeth) with the Europa lock stop and steering rods/nuts but reckons it's bit too sensitive. That said, he refurbished an ex-racer that from parts so hadn't driven one before?

Offline chrisbeck

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Re: steering rack
« Reply #35 on: Monday,January 20, 2020, 02:18:38 PM »
I'm just annoyed that I assumed my original rack was 6-tooth as both Triumph units are available on eBay. I should have stripped mine first  :huh:

Offline EdWills

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Re: steering rack
« Reply #36 on: Wednesday,November 25, 2020, 12:42:24 PM »
This is a heads-up on something that isn't generally known about the Spitfire rack.  It has a central section, the bit of the rack that comes into action in straight ahead driving where the teeth have been cut fractionally shallower, that is more metal is left on the rack leading to a high point in the teeth.  The shims to minimise pinion backlash are adjusted [in the Spitfire] at this point. That's all fine so far because when the car is steering a corner the rack is under load, but has a fraction more backlash where the teeth have been cut deeper.

Lotus took a standard rack and moved the effective centre point, the straight ahead position off-centre.  This means that if the rack is adjusted for minimum backlash at the straight ahead position it will jam when it reaches the high point in the rack.  This only applies to types 54, 65 and standard TC.  The TCS had a different arrangement where the rack is properly centred.

Hi.  Also as a newbie, I have been doing some research on a possible replacement for the Herald/Spitfire rack fitted to my 1969 Lotus Seven Series 3.  Ages ago I photocopied some pages from a book I found at my local library regarding the Triumph Spitfire.  I cannot recall the author or book title to give credit unfortunately, but a full description of the mechanical properties of the complete rack and ball joint assemblies was provided.  The book confirmed that the middle teeth (I would have to count them to confirm) were machined 5 thousandths of an inch higher than the rest to provide 'stiction' (hope this is the correct term?) in the straight-ahead position. 

Also as noted on the Mcleans Bridge site, the geared rack 'bars' and tie rods were manufactured in various lengths.  I have 2 Spitfire racks where the rack bar is 26 inches long, but recently obtained a spare where it is 25.5 inches long (TR4?). The Mcleans Bridge site provides excellent information on the various racks produced by Alford and Alder/Triumph.  The measurements are given in metric values, but the U.K. did not begin going partly metric until 1965.  Before and probably quite a time after that date, the U.K. was still using Imperial measure, and I am guessing that most of the Stanpart items were still Imperial values until well into the 70s?.   I am grateful to the administrator for reproducing the article from the Club Lotus magazine by Brian Buckland, as it provides clarity on the modifications performed/required by Lotus.  For the Seven, 2 - 1" long rack stops were provided of 1 inch outside diameter for a sliding fit on the rack bar., and the tie rod thread was shortened along with the outer ball joint (3/8" and 1/4" respectively).  One of my racks came with tie rods of exactly 6 inches long, and these are not cut from a longer version.  They were produced to this length and have the lathe centres at each end.  Unfortunately one of them was probably 'curbed', and is not safe for re-use (on an Elan for instance).  I have also investigated the new German manufactured racks produced for Triumph vehicles through the German company 'Bastuck'.  I was sent a couple of emails by a sales rep. that shows the tie rods as attached to the geared rack bar. These racks do not use a locking nut to secure the tie rod ball joint to the rack bar.  Unfortunately, the sales rep could not advise if the tie rods could be unbolted to allow the fitting of necessary rack stops as fitted by Lotus.  It seems no one has had to disassemble a German rack as they are still fairly new.  Various Triumph sites proved negative in this respect.  Forum members on these sites confirmed that Argentine manufactured racks are sealed for life and cannot be safely disassembled.  Although cheaper than the German units, there were some negative comments on these South American racks regarding quality control.  I have a page from an old Dave Bean parts catalogue that may have been copied from Lotus if anyone is interested? It shows the various rack parts for the Elan and Plus 2 and shows the rack extension for the Europa. I contacted a sales person at DBE, and was advised that they had sourced a German manufactured rack from British Parts North America to see if it would be suitable for a Lotus.  DBE advised that they thought that it 'would not be suitable', although they didn't explain why or how much they had attempted to disassemble the rack assembly.  If of any value, and with the administrator's permission, I can post the DBE Lotus rack page, and also the photos of the German rack with the bellows slid aside.  Cheers, EW

Offline BDA

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Re: steering rack
« Reply #37 on: Wednesday,November 25, 2020, 03:21:12 PM »
 :Welcome: EdWills!!

That%u2019s a lot of good information about racks! I rebuilt my rack - actually, more like added the Europa bits to a Spitfire rack. I believe it was Richard at Banks wo told me that the best that could be done is for straight-ahead to be a little looser than either side and to consider that when adjusting the pinion, but I didn%u2019t know about I was not aware of the taller teeth on the rack. I will say that although my rack was supposed to be only 40,000 miles old, it did exhibit the looseness characteristics Richard mentioned to me. On the other hand, 40,000 miles on a Spitfire is surely more severe than 40,000 miles on a modern car!

In studying racks back when I was rebuilding mine, I found there more variations than I imagined. As for %u201Ccurrent%u201D racks, I%u2019m only aware of a %u201Cquick%u201C rack which is not appropriate for Europas. Could that be the German unit you were talking about?

Chances are that DBE experimented with the German unit many years ago so memory of details of their investigation may be lost, but Ken Gray has been there a long time and usually can recall details. If you%u2019re still interested their evaluation, you might ask him.

Edit: If you haven%u2019t already, you might want to check the beginning of this thread. There are some articles back there that might be of interest.
« Last Edit: Wednesday,November 25, 2020, 03:33:19 PM by BDA »