Restoration of 2358R

[BDA]

I only used Loktite on the splines to hub interface. It must be the proper type. It's green as I remember. I don't remember the number. r. d. enterprises has it.

[jbcollier]

Please put a swipe of light grease between the seal's lips.  Loctite is only used on the splines.  635 is the correct type as it sets slowly, giving you time to assemble everything.  Just double checking, you have the spacer in place between the two bearings?

The assembled bearing housings have to be attached to their respective radius arms before fitting the half-shaft's axles.

Is it a press fit?  It's not an interference fit but it is snug.  I seem to recall having to tap mine home with a soft-face mallet.

[Roger]

Right, no loctite on the bearing/axle fit.
Very important loctite on the hub splines, when you get there.

[jbcollier]

Some people incorrectly push out the old bearings, damaging the housing's bearing bores.  If the new bearings drop in, with no play, then you can use loctite bearing retainer to keep them in place.  If there is any play, then you have to have to housings machined and fitted with steel sleeves to bring them back into spec.

[EuropaTC]

Just to double check, the hub bearing assembly is press fit onto the axle stub. No Loctite to hold the bearings to the axle.....correct?

I've not used loctite on the bearings, just the driveshaft splines & hub interface.   I think the only time I'd use it on bearings is if I felt the fit was a bit on the loose side, but if it's a good press fit than I wouldn't bother.

[andy harwood]

Thought I remembered a slinger/flinger on one of the stub axles of my 74 TCS I bought. Only one side had a slinger - but the car had been in a accident, and the stub axle may have been replaced along with the hub carrier.
2nd pic is the mod that was made to the transaxle shifter shaft universal joint, to increase clamping force. I think the mod is in the GGLC tech articles.
Would have posted sooner, but was not at home.

[buzzer]

That’s a good mod on the gearbox shifter. I was thinking about that type of  mod on mine. I fitted it with the std roll pin at the moment but I had to sleeve out the hole in the shaft as it was oversize so I’m concerned that it could work loose. Also allows it to be much more serviceable.

[Certified Lotus]

Thanks for everyone's comments, directives and suggestions. All appreciated.  Helps to always have extra data before making a hard decision.

Installed the axles to the transaxle using two (2) shims on each side (wouldn't take more) before tapping in the pins to hold the axles in place.  Will safety wire in place at a later point in time.

I have been mulling the oil seal and flinger situation for several weeks now. Issue number one was the correct placement of the oil seals on the inside of the bearing hub.  The question was which way did the seal face as the two sets of hubs I had disassembled had the seals open to the side of the yoke. But most of you said it should be the other way around.  So I bought two new seals, removed the ones I had installed "incorrectly" and replaced them with new seals with the metal cap facing the yoke.  THEN my friend Bruce emails me from Mexico to let me know that he is rebuilding his Europa TC rear bearing hubs and his oil seals were also installed with the open end of the seal towards the yoke and no flingers. OK then, WTF...... 

My friend Chris came over today with his Elan and we bled his clutch to remove some air bubbles and then we go thru all the postings on this subject of oil seals and flingers as well and reread Bruce's email.  And here is the ah-ha moment...... I took a magnifying glass to the engineering drawing of the hub that is in the shop manual and low and behold it shows the seal with the open end towards the yoke. For those that have engineering backgrounds or formal training in mechanical drawing will note that a darker solid line against a lighter drawn line is showing something different.  If you look very closely a the drawing in the shop manual it shows the seal open towards the yoke.

Well, I have already installed the new seals with the metal cap the other way around. Chris and I spend an hour doing measurement and take off's to determine if the seal is mounted in reverse will it still be on the collar of the axle.  The answer is yes. Then we have another conversation regarding in the flingers. My are used and don't have a tight fit.  Using Loctite bearing sealer might hold them in place, but no guarantee. With the thought that the flingers might be rotating around the axle collar and bouncing against the outside edge of the rubber seal would not be a good idea. The flingers come off.

JB, no worries, the metal spacer is inside between the two bearings.

We bolt on the hubs to the correct swing arms, grease everything nicely to insure a smooth fit of the bearings and seals and mount a bearing collar behind the yoke with threaded studs attached to a metal plate that has a hole in the middle. Out comes my trusty air ratchet wrench and slowly tighten each stud in succession to pull the hub onto the stub axle.   

Chris had to go but I was on a roll and wanted to get the suspension in place.  Installed the shocks and lower control arms.  The big question here is my original install had these spacers on the lower hub bolt to align the shock and control arm.  I read the shop manual again as it didn't show any spacers in the drawings.  Mmmmmm...what is up with this?  After a couple of different configurations I decide the small spacer needs to go next to the outside of the hub so the shock is horizontal when compressed.  Is this correct?

Everything is placed but not bolted down until I get more data and research further. By the way, the question about using Loctite on the axle where the bearing are located was because the shop manual suggest you do this. I scratched my head at this and had Chris read the manual, he thought the same. Didn't make sense which is why I asked the question to everyone looking over my shoulder on this site.

Lots of little decisions, I wonder how many correct......  Looking forward to comments 

[BDA]

Congratulations on your progress! She's really starting to come together! 

The orientation of that seal is very surprising! I hope it works out for you. I have no memory of what I did about it but I don't remember worrying about it so whatever I did was without drama and seems to be working fine so far.

I wouldn't worry about the spacer for your rear shocks. The idea is for them to be vertical, as you said.

[GavinT]

Re the oil seal:
Presumably the new inner bearings you’ve installed are the 2RS variety?
For example 6006 2RS.
The 2RS suffix denotes 2 rubber seals.
The outer bearing shown in one of your pics appears to be the 2RS variety.

If so, the oil seal you’ve installed is essentially a secondary seal. I expect this why JB implored the addition of a swipe of grease (which would be usual anyway) because it likely won’t see any lubrication going forward . . which means it’ll turn into a pretty good dust seal. 

I haven’t looked at the shop manual but it wouldn’t be the first mistake in a shop manual.
IlRC the S2 manual shows a pic of the transaxle with the crown wheel on the wrong side . . because the pic was lifted straight out of the Renault 16 manual . . there’s a surprise waiting for someone.

Perhaps that’s also why many insist the seal faces out? . . contrary to the intended fitting of the part in any other installation?
That said, the rear uprights have a hole in the bottom of the casting so there’s never going to be a pressure build up so it’ll work no matter which way it’s installed, I reckon.


Re the pic of the damper mountings - DSC09972.jpg:
Is it my imagination or are the damper bushes slightly distorted?

Maybe it’s just the angle of the pic but it almost seems as if the top mounting should be further forward . . . or the lower one further back.
Obviously neither of those are optional and the suspension is in droop so I presume it all becomes correct at normal ride height?

By the way, I love the brilliant pics and watching this all come together.
Great job.

[Certified Lotus]

GavinT, the comment about the bearings already having dust seals was a big part of the conversation Chris and I had at the work bench while looking at the shop drawing. With the “new” bearings already configured that way, the outer oil seal was redundant and it’s only purpose was to prevent road dirt and water from entering the bearing housing. The flinger was to provide even more deterant for road dirt to approach the seal. Thanks for confirming our joint thinking.

Regarding the shock (damper) bushings, it an optical illusion that they seem distorted. They are not even bolted in as the nuts are just in place, no tightening. When I was testing the vertical alignment of the shocks (because my original set up had spacers) I put a hydraulic floor jack under the hub and jacked it up to put the shocks under load test the alignment and see if any binding occurred.looked good to me, but the real test will be when I complete the rear suspension with brakes and bolt everything in to put the wheels and tires on.

Glad you like the photos. I do this for all my rebuilds (for myself) as it provides a visual documentation of what has been done and is easy to reference for future projects or repairs at a later date.  Figured I might as well share the info for all to see as it will help anyone who is in the midst of a project or considering doing this. If I was retired and had more time I would shoot videos, but that is very time consuming and the editing alone takes a lot of effort......one day.

BDA I thought same, vertical is what is important for the shocks, but I need to have them fully compressed on the wheels to determine if the spacer is needed. Jacking up the hub gave me enough of a perspective, but the shocks didn’t fully compress so I will have to wait until I am ready to bolt on the wheels. (I’m really waiting for the rear disk brake kit to be completed).

[Certified Lotus]

Thought I remembered a slinger/flinger on one of the stub axles of my 74 TCS I bought. Only one side had a slinger - but the car had been in a accident, and the stub axle may have been replaced along with the hub carrier.
2nd pic is the mod that was made to the transaxle shifter shaft universal joint, to increase clamping force. I think the mod is in the GGLC tech articles.
Would have posted sooner, but was not at home.

Andy, thanks for the photos. You have confirmed the flinger (slinger) is mounted with the collar facing the seal. Like your car, one of my axles had a flinger and the other did not. On the race car I bought and disassembled it had no flingers.

Interesting modification to the shift joint linkage. I’m guessing this is a major source of problems for the shifting (the rear link being too loose). I was able to locate a new OEM rear link although it was for a 15mm shift tube and mine is an earlier 13mm. I had a bronze bushing made with hole drilled to match the hole in the joint and press fitted. Will pin it and safety wire. Will see how long it lasts.

[jbcollier]

You will want to fit the brake backing plates before loctiting the splines in place.

The rear wheel bearing/axle set-up is not particularly robust.  They started with just having the 2RS inner bearing (early S1) and then added the seal (late S1) and finally the slinger (TC/S) in an effort to prolong bearing life.

The weak point, other than the axle made out of butter, is bearing spacer.  Originally it's basically just exhaust pipe: seam-welded, mild steel.  Lotus stressed fitting a new spacer every time.  Better is to fit a set of the hardened aftermarket spacers made out out of chromoly, seamless tubing.

[Certified Lotus]

Your reading my mind JB. I have the brake backing plate all painted and next to the hubs ready for install.  I was hoping to have a disc brake solution identified by now, but the timing is off so I will be installing the drum brakes until some later point in time. The in-place assembly was just to take the parts and put them in the right areas without bolting everything down.

The bearing spacers I have are hardened, no seams and they certainly aren’t exhaust pipe. If I had seen that I would have changed out emediately.

And then there is the point that this will be a fair weather sports car, not a daily driver. The bearings should last a long time 

[dakazman]

Certified,
Attention to details is why your build will be researched many years to come.
As you once stated  , DROOL.  Congrats.
Dakazman