Author Topic: One last hard chore, frame head rust removal!  (Read 1571 times)

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Offline Richard48Y

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One last hard chore, frame head rust removal!
« on: Monday,December 26, 2022, 01:15:44 AM »
With a new frame $3K-$4K plus shipping that is out of the question.
My frame is actually pretty good except for a couple of small areas I decided to patch due to rust pitting.
Where I am undecided for how to proceed is the scale that has formed between layers of steel at the forward frame head.
In one area I have cut out the back-side and will patch it. (Pics in the AM)
Without cutting the whole frame head apart I cannot reach this scale physically.
So this seems to require a chemical solution, but which?

Candidates in no particular order.

White vinegar soak. Cheap in quantity, claimed to be effective, probably slow.
CLR. Never tried it, label says removes stains, I have scale.
OSPHO, Never tried it, expensive in quantity, speed and effectiveness?
Vaporust, I use this often and am pretty happy with it. But enough to soak the whole frame head in would get somewhat expensive and I know it is slow or ineffective for heavy scale.

I will use thin blades to break up as much scale as I may reach.
It would be great to just have the chassis dipped but that is an extravagant expense even if I could locate a somewhat local facility doing that work.

So who has done this and what worked best - most inexpensively?

Offline TurboFource

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Re: One last hard chore, frame head rust removal!
« Reply #1 on: Monday,December 26, 2022, 04:55:18 AM »
The OSPHO won’t remove the rust, just convert it. The vinegar would definitely be slow.
Muriatic acid will remove rust but you need to be careful of the fumes and use the proper safety precautions dealing with an acid.
The more I do the more I find I need to do....

Offline jbcollier

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Re: One last hard chore, frame head rust removal!
« Reply #2 on: Monday,December 26, 2022, 05:35:58 AM »
Muriatic acid leaves the metal bare and extremely rust prone.  Phosphoric acid would be a better choice as it leaves the surface neutral.

Large flakes of rust would indicate to me that there has been significant metal deterioration.  You can buy just the “T” section and replace it as a whole.  Might be a better way to go.

Offline TurboFource

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Re: One last hard chore, frame head rust removal!
« Reply #3 on: Monday,December 26, 2022, 07:42:11 AM »
Pics?
The more I do the more I find I need to do....

Offline Richard48Y

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Re: One last hard chore, frame head rust removal!
« Reply #4 on: Monday,December 26, 2022, 10:28:00 AM »
Searched the usual suspects without finding any frame heads for sale.
Recommended source?

Mine is not horrible but I never want to have to repair it again so want to remove as much rust as possible before conversion treatment.

I will edit in some pics once I get moving, kind of stiff today.

Online BDA

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Re: One last hard chore, frame head rust removal!
« Reply #5 on: Monday,December 26, 2022, 11:00:07 AM »
Spyder (https://www.spydercars.co.uk/) seems to make them for repairing Lotus OEM frames (from https://www.spydercars.co.uk/lotus-europa-chassis-wheels/: "Europa repair original chassis new front section shot blast & paint") but they don't list them as parts. It might be worth a call to them.

Offline Kendo

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Re: One last hard chore, frame head rust removal!
« Reply #6 on: Monday,December 26, 2022, 11:24:44 AM »
Fifty percent of an entire frame for just the front section. Sounds a bit steep.

Offline TurboFource

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Re: One last hard chore, frame head rust removal!
« Reply #7 on: Monday,December 26, 2022, 11:43:50 AM »
I think that includes doing the repair and blasting/painting the chassis
The more I do the more I find I need to do....

Offline jbcollier

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Re: One last hard chore, frame head rust removal!
« Reply #8 on: Monday,December 26, 2022, 11:45:11 AM »
That includes fitment, blasting and paint.  If they sell just the section, it would be considerably cheaper.

Offline dakazman

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Re: One last hard chore, frame head rust removal!
« Reply #9 on: Monday,December 26, 2022, 01:53:28 PM »
Spyder (https://www.spydercars.co.uk/) seems to make them for repairing Lotus OEM frames (from https://www.spydercars.co.uk/lotus-europa-chassis-wheels/: "Europa repair original chassis new front section shot blast & paint") but they don't list them as parts. It might be worth a call to them.

Wow, Those minilites in 14", tires are getting harder to find and that might help.
Dakazman

Offline Richard48Y

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Re: One last hard chore, frame head rust removal!
« Reply #10 on: Monday,December 26, 2022, 03:35:08 PM »
Pics as promised.
First four are the main frame head repair.
There are a couple more in the top rail but they are simpler as they are single layer.
The piece I cut out was rusted through.
The repair piece includes a stepped flange and several holes for plug welding.
I was also unhappy about the separation between the layers of factory steel, that will not exist with the new repair.

Pic five is a patch under an engine mount.
The outside reinforcement bows and lets moisture/crud collect behind it.

Pic six is where I will be repairing the original flange near the rear of the Y.

The last pic is a small reinforcement for a crack in the Y flange.

« Last Edit: Monday,December 26, 2022, 03:45:53 PM by Richard48Y »

Online BDA

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Re: One last hard chore, frame head rust removal!
« Reply #11 on: Monday,December 26, 2022, 03:39:06 PM »
Spyder (https://www.spydercars.co.uk/) seems to make them for repairing Lotus OEM frames (from https://www.spydercars.co.uk/lotus-europa-chassis-wheels/: "Europa repair original chassis new front section shot blast & paint") but they don't list them as parts. It might be worth a call to them.

Wow, Those minilites in 14", tires are getting harder to find and that might help.
Dakazman

Minilights are also available in 15” too (https://www.minilitewheels.us/mag-style-sizesj. I think 15” is a bit more common than 14”.

Offline TurboFource

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Re: One last hard chore, frame head rust removal!
« Reply #12 on: Monday,December 26, 2022, 06:47:15 PM »
Looks like you got  it under control Richard!
The more I do the more I find I need to do....

Offline Richard48Y

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Re: One last hard chore, frame head rust removal!
« Reply #13 on: Monday,December 26, 2022, 07:45:03 PM »
If I buy POR-15, how many quarts to do a Europa chassis?

Offline EuropaTC

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Re: One last hard chore, frame head rust removal!
« Reply #14 on: Monday,December 26, 2022, 11:38:05 PM »
Hi Richard,

When I did my TC chassis years ago, that also had heavy corrosion around the engine mounts. Mine wasn't restricted to the centre of the mount, in fact the worst bit was just in front of the mount and after a few prods it became a hole.

It puzzled me at first but when you think about it, those engine mounts take more than just the engine weight, they also have body loading in corners.  I thought at the time that the reinforced area wasn't large enough so you got flexing at the edges of the plate, cue more reinforcement !

Brian