Author Topic: U joint removal? TC linkage  (Read 2442 times)

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Offline cal44

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U joint removal? TC linkage
« on: Tuesday,July 03, 2012, 04:16:46 PM »
Can't figure out how to remove the old U-joint so that I can install the new one.  The pix show small washers tac welded into place, is this factory or did someone do this after the fact.  Because of the washers the body of the U-joint cannot be pressed either way.
Unless I am looking at this wrong. 

Any ideas?

Mike
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Offline cal44

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Re: U joint removal? TC linkage
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday,July 04, 2012, 01:42:27 PM »
Me and my trusty hacksaw........got it.  Now, with the caps removed, installing the new u-joint won't fit in  the U so that the new caps can be pressed on.  damn.........it's always something.............

This ujoint came from one of the suppliers and is pre-assembled which is causing me a headache.  If it were in two separate pieces it would be much more simple.
« Last Edit: Wednesday,July 04, 2012, 02:12:00 PM by cal44 »
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Offline EuropaTC

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Re: U joint removal? TC linkage
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday,July 04, 2012, 11:07:44 PM »
Hi Mike,
Hmm, now that you've posted a picture I can see the problem, and if I'm honest I'm a bit stuck. I know I replaced the rear central spider as one of the first jobs after getting my car, but it's too long ago for me to remember details about doing it.  It could have been that my replacement joint was different because it almost certainly was a 1960/70s period manufacture as I'd have bought it from an autojumble. I just can't remember, but whatever the reason, it doesn't help us now.

So looking at that fork with the welded in washers, it does make me wonder if they were tack welded after assembly to allow a touch extra clearance when putting in the joint ?  I can't remember welding mine up, but then again I've forgotten far more important things over the last few years  ::)

I think I'd be tempted to take off the washers with a grinder because even if that doesn't work it's a reversible action and the car isn't going anywhere as it is !  I'll go down to the garage later on and take a look at my car to see if there's any sign that I ended up doing the same thing.

Brian

Offline cal44

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Re: U joint removal? TC linkage
« Reply #3 on: Thursday,July 05, 2012, 05:45:28 AM »
Brian,

I'm thinking the same thing.  Since the new ujoint/housing cannot be taken apart, the washers seem too be the best choice for  removal.  I had another fellow contact me and mention the washers were also on his '73 TC.  So, I'm guessing is was a factory install.

But parts change........even at times for the better.  Soooo I will remove the washers and give it a go.  Will report back either way.

Mike
"Be Polite, Be Professional, But have a plan to kill everyone you meet"
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United States Marines

Offline EuropaTC

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Re: U joint removal? TC linkage
« Reply #4 on: Friday,July 06, 2012, 12:56:36 AM »
Any progress Mike ?  I had a look at my car and the washers are still in place.  I tried to take a photo, not so good as I've parked the lawn mower behind the car so it's a bit cramped. (and it's like a monsoon here at the moment so it's not the time for moving stuff about !)

I think I'd remember if I'd re-welded them so I'm beginning to think I did the job without removal. Looking at the universal joint, it's clearly different from your original and the replacement, so maybe that's how I managed it. Perhaps the bearing surfaces were slightly smaller or it was just an older joint assembled differently.  I'll try to attach some shots so you can see what I'm on about.

Brian




Offline EuropaTC

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Re: U joint removal? TC linkage
« Reply #5 on: Friday,July 06, 2012, 01:00:57 AM »
Ah, the pictures displayed ok, I couldn't see them on preview so wondered if they come across. If you look at the edges if the square block you can see it's different from the OEM version but you can still see the original washers tacked in place.

If you're reluctant to remove the washers, one thought is that you might get away with grinding a bevel on the ends of the new bearing section, maybe 1/8" or so which shouldn't seriously affect the life but might give enough clearance to get it in place ?

(Just noticed our new puppy has managed to get in on the act, he's everywhere at the moment. Well, everywhere that there's either dirt, oil or something to eat.....)

Offline cal44

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Re: U joint removal? TC linkage
« Reply #6 on: Friday,July 06, 2012, 07:59:32 AM »
Brian,

thanks for the pix and yep.....looks like the same thing +/-.........I finally cut a section out of the old joint and got it out by pressing out the the long pin first then really getting serious, cut it in half.  Filed off the old washers.

Had a nice talk with one of the suppliers about the size of the new U-joint, the caps are just a little bigger and will not press in without hurting the needle bearings in the end.  So I need to drill out the holes by a 1000th or 2 and press in the works.  Or take it too the machine shop and let them do it as I don't have the correct drill or press............This has tuned into a real cluster - - - - ............but, the bearings in all of the linkage were shot so it needed to be done.  I just didn't want to spend the rest of what's left of my life doing it...........

Love the pup.  I've had dogs and I have had kids..................I'd rather have a dog.

Mike
"Be Polite, Be Professional, But have a plan to kill everyone you meet"
General "mad dog" James Mattis
United States Marines

Offline cal44

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Re: U joint removal? TC linkage
« Reply #7 on: Monday,July 09, 2012, 04:40:26 PM »
And the story continues.  I took the parts to a local machine shop.  The guy took measurements and stated the new U-Joint was 15mm and he didn't have a drill bit that size to drill out the linkage.  You see the old joint was 14mm, he couldn't help me.  I then drove over the local Tool Mart.  They had a proper drill bit in which I purchased, just under 15mm, I think it is 14.85mm........good for me!  I will just insert it into my half inch drill  and get to work.

Not so fast Mikey............the drill bit is 15mm which is over one half inch (merican').  It doesn't fit in the drill chuck.......
So now I am relegated to using mirco baby files to make the hole bigger...........but not to big.

I'm telling the tale so that someone else doesn't go through this........oh' wait.  They will indeed go through this.
The metal  shift linkage is quite soft.  I think once I get the new U-joint set I will make a locking mechanism frame and a couple of bolts with nylocks nuts..........just to be safe.

More later.

Mike

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Offline LotusJoe

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Re: U joint removal? TC linkage
« Reply #8 on: Monday,July 09, 2012, 08:39:22 PM »
Mike, thanks for the progress report. Keep at it  :welder:
Joe Irwin
3927R TC Special
(The Classic Barn Find)


Offline EuropaTC

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Re: U joint removal? TC linkage
« Reply #9 on: Monday,July 09, 2012, 11:00:37 PM »
Gee, I'm glad I did mine back in the day when we had a proper measuring system and not this metric nonsense... ;)

If you took your new drill to the machine shop, would they drill it out for you ? If so that would probably be neater than filing the hole to size, although I've done the same thing myself when I hadn't got the correct tapping drill for a thread.   One way to clean up the file marks and try to get the hole a bit "rounder" is to use a dremel with a small flap wheel to clean it up when the bulk of metal removal is done.

I think the linkage is only mild steel so it should enlarge quite easily. I would use something like Loctite's "bearing Fit", the one which claims to take up large gaps in bearing housings and needs a blowtorch to dismantle it afterwards. (the same stuff you use on the rear hub splines). That will make up for any out-of-roundness and hold everything nice and tight.

Offline cal44

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Re: U joint removal? TC linkage
« Reply #10 on: Tuesday,July 10, 2012, 09:09:59 AM »
Brian,

yes to the mild steel. Bearing Fit Compoind sounds like the ticket,  will order some today.  Dremel it is.  After spending decades with other marques I am not used to making such adjustments and finding difficult parts.  But once behind the wheel I forget the PITA issues.

Then my next task is to fix the tailshaft leak in back...........thing leaks like drunk sailor on leave...........If I can't fix it from the outside then that means the brass insert is not round of is scratched and must be attacked from within.

After replacing the shift seal on the 356 Porsche (now sold) I am used to replacement issues.  Sold? yes, they are neat looking cars but boring to drive........listening to that darn engine on the freeway drove me crazier............ :P

Since driving a Europa in summer in SoCal is not my ideal test for heat comfort I will be taking my time on the fixes.



Mike
« Last Edit: Tuesday,July 10, 2012, 03:49:16 PM by cal44 »
"Be Polite, Be Professional, But have a plan to kill everyone you meet"
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Offline cal44

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Re: U joint removal? TC linkage
« Reply #11 on: Wednesday,July 18, 2012, 01:40:40 PM »
A little update with a few pix to follow later today.  Remember I bought the 15 mm drill bit that does not fit in my 1/2" drill chuck?

Well, little files from Harbor Freight (throw away's), a Dremel Tool with grinder wheel and a whole lot of patience, got the two holes close enough for me to put on a leather glove and start twisting the drill bit in the holes. 

Yes, I know, it was like Primitive Pete in metal shop......in school during the sixties.  A little oil, a little turn and finally? a darn near perfect hole to push in the U-Joint caps during the install of the J-Joint.  The U shaped meta,l that is the base to which the cap of the  Joint is pushed in is so soft it kept distorting when pushing in the cap. 




Mild steel is putting it mildly...........it's like sub-mild steel.

Now that I have all the parts I will be setting up the linkage and reading the manual for proper measurements.
Mike
« Last Edit: Wednesday,July 18, 2012, 06:02:20 PM by cal44 »
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Offline LotusJoe

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Re: U joint removal? TC linkage
« Reply #12 on: Wednesday,July 18, 2012, 04:40:58 PM »
 :beerchug: way to go Mike!

Joe Irwin
3927R TC Special
(The Classic Barn Find)


Offline EuropaTC

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Re: U joint removal? TC linkage
« Reply #13 on: Wednesday,July 18, 2012, 09:49:18 PM »
Hi Mike,

10 out of 10 for perseverance, when I read how you'd enlarged the holes by hand reaming them, well, that's true grit. You sir, are a proper car restorer !!

And it looks great. A really neat job that looks OEM, in fact knowing Lotus cars it's probably better than OEM !  I'm sure once you get it all together you'll notice a difference. The change is never going to be slick but you can make it work reasonably well if everything is tightened up from the change lever backwards.

Brian