Gearbox issue ? TC 365 gearbox

[Jesspo]

What would be the correct way?  to replace the shaft Pins

What is easier the gearbox removing with the clutch bell together or? Orthe clutch house remaining on

[BDA]

I'm certainly no expert, but your roll pins seem like a good place to start - you're going to need new ones anyway - so I would be tempted to start there. This is dependent on your not having any recent trouble in that area.


If you do have to take the tranny out, separate the bell housing from the engine and take it out that way.


Just my guess. Good luck!

[jbcollier]

The is thread should be in the garage section.

Broken halfshaft pins are not uncommon and, in and of themselves, will not cause any noise*.  Pins can fail if the halfshaft yokes are not properly shimmed first.  If the yokes are not shimmed properly then loads are applied to the diff sun and spider gears which can lead to wear and noise. With the halfshafts removed, check the two output shafts for play.  There should be virtually none.  If it is truly "clacking", I would drain the oil and check for debris.  If there is debris, you'll need to strip the transaxle and see what's up.

* I run a twin link system with no pins and it is quiet.

[EuropaTC]

Like BDA I'm far from expert in gearbox matters so bear that in mind about my comments.

I would also be tempted to replace the pins and see if the noise goes away. However, as JB says, pins don't usually "just break" because the driving loads should be going through the splines and the pins should only be there to hold the driveshaft hard up against the gearbox.  So if the pin has gone my first port of call would be the shims between the driveshaft & differential because if they aren't sufficient then the pins receive cornering loads and they're not meant for that. Also there's a good chance of damage to the gearbox internals, so when you replace the pins make sure the shimming is correct.

If the noise is still present when the pins are replaced and shimming is correct, then it's sounding like JB's suggestion of draining the oil is a good way forwards because if you do have to remove the gearbox then you might as well get the oil out first anyway.

The other faint possibility is the UJ's in the driveshafts. Are they old or recent ?  I'd expect some mechanical noise whenever a worn one was turning but that it would be louder under load. Perhaps rolling with the clutch down reduces the noise significantly and you can't hear it from the cabin ?

Finally, if you do have to remove the gearbox I'd take it out with the bellhousing on it. That's what I did a while ago to replace the clutch and I don't think there's any other way of doing it with the way mine is bolted together ?

Brian

[BDA]

The original "spiral" roll pins are sometimes hard to find so they are replaced with a bigger pin in which a smaller one is fitted.

[EuropaTC]

Ouch !

I can't help other than offer sympathy, I don't know if parts from other Renault gearboxes are interchangeable even if they aren't the ideal ratios. The 365 box was a rare bird years ago, I can only suggest trying some of the classic Renault (Alpine ?) forums to see what's around today.

In your position I'd give Richard a call; he'll probably know if there are any interchangeable parts even if he doesn't have anything in stock and he's the guy I'd want to talk to about any other options, such as an NG3 conversion.

Brian

[BDA]

Man, that's tough luck! I second Brian's suggestion to give Richard a call.


Good luck!

[jbcollier]

Sorry for your loss.

Looks like Meca Parts has them, MP 1628:

http://www.mecaparts.com/Cinematique/page.php?lang=0&sortie=html&col=A110&page=16#ok

[EuropaTC]

I'm amazed the parts are still available at any price, that's a stunning bit of detective work JB. 

When I was looking for a car back in the 80s I had the option of a black JPS special in excellent condition other than the 5 speed box was broken. The car was perfect but I declined after spending a few weeks trying to find parts to fix it (pre internet of course) because the only option then was to replace with an NG3 or get the gears fabricated.  The NG3 route was new and expensive back then, I had silly prices quoted for one-off gears so I ended up with my current 4 speed TC.

Any ideas on how the damage happened ? Is it shimming or worn bearings throwing things out of alignment ?

Brian

[BDA]

Am I missing something? Looking at the parts manual, the 352 and 365 share the same frame and linkage. I think it should be a drop in.

[EuropaTC]

I thought so as well but before posting I checked my parts book and the 365 has got a different number for the last section. I've no idea what the difference is because I thought they looked the same, perhaps it's a slightly different angle on the sweeping bend ?

Secondhand parts look the best option but it would be good to know the reason for failure before rebuilding with what's going to be expensive parts no matter where they come from.

Brian

[Bainford]

Wow! This is a real shame. Sorry to hear this, and very curious failure mode. Have you been hearing any unusual noises, roughness, or vibration lately? Anything unusual at all? Is your engine modified in any way?

If you learn what caused this or see anything else that might be amiss inside the gearbox, please post it here. I would be very interested to know more about how this happened.

[BDA]

I thought so as well but before posting I checked my parts book and the 365 has got a different number for the last section. I've no idea what the difference is because I thought they looked the same, perhaps it's a slightly different angle on the sweeping bend ?

I would guess that the difference is the back linkage piece for the 352 is shorter than the 365 and everything else is the same. I would think it would be an easy mod to make (as long as someone was somewhat skilled at fabrication - not me!). I would think it would be worth a call to Richard or Ray (at rdent) or Dave (at Dave Bean).

[jbcollier]

There were a variety of rear hoops for the TC but the hoop for the 365 version will also take a 352 with the appropriate bracketry.

The only difference in the shift linkage is the length of the various tubes.

[jbcollier]

PS: 365 gearboxes do come up for sale occasionally on ebay and the various Lotus forums/lists.