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Lotus Europa Forums => Garage => Topic started by: Gmg31 on Monday,July 13, 2015, 04:47:06 AM

Title: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,July 13, 2015, 04:47:06 AM
So my latest project arrived on Saturday on the back of a trailer.  This is a 1970 Europa owned by Colin Chapman's Doctor.  At some point he had an Else conversion done but then the car caught fire and had to be re shelled.   All of the running gear was updated with what looks like fairly new suspension and brakes but the Else engine was seized and despite being gifted a brand new engine by Mr Chapman the project was never finished.  The car has sat for at least 35 years gathering dust and offering a home for many mice. 

So on Sunday I stripped out the interior and cleaned out the mouse poo and the mould.  The body is in near perfect condition with only a few chips.  I jet washed all the crud off the body and degreased and washed both engines and the gearbox. 

I have started to make preparations to lift the body off the chassis. I'm assuming that once the body has been unbolted it will just be a two man job just to lift onto a trailer so I can send it off to paint?

Given the brand new engine has sat for at least 35 years would you change the head gasket?

I tried to upload photos last night but it failed so I'll try again tonight.

I'm happy to listen to all advice, so don't be shy.   
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Monday,July 13, 2015, 05:38:04 AM
Very interesting story on your car! That's quite a find!

You might be able to get away with needing only one friend to trailer the body but three or four of you would make the job a lot easier. As for the engine, I don't think I'd worry about the head gasket. You might check the carbs for varnish or dirt. I would also try to get some lube, like assy. lube, on the cam lobes. I would also not fire it up till I got oil pressure.

Can't wait to see some pics! Let us know if you need help with that.

Good luck!
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Grumblebuns on Monday,July 13, 2015, 06:47:35 AM
Have to agree about needing more than two people for lifting a body with all glass and the doors still installed. That sucker is heavy.

For a brand new engine that has been sitting idle for 40+ years, try to roll the car in gear to see if it will turn over.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,July 13, 2015, 01:06:03 PM
I bought this off a trader and he had removed the sump and the bearings in order to oil them and  turned it all over before re fitting. As far as I can tell it turns over smoothly by hand.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Grumblebuns on Monday,July 13, 2015, 01:52:52 PM
Someone posted a write up on the Europa body removal. It's for a TCS but most should apply to an S2 also.

http://lotus-europa.com/manuals/misc/body/Body_Removal.html

Joji Tokumoto
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,July 13, 2015, 02:43:13 PM
Delivery
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,July 13, 2015, 02:45:56 PM
Interior removed
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,July 13, 2015, 02:46:59 PM
Empty engine bay
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: StrawberryCheesecake on Monday,July 13, 2015, 03:13:44 PM
Very interesting story on your car! That's quite a find!

You might be able to get away with needing only one friend to trailer the body but three or four of you would make the job a lot easier. As for the engine, I don't think I'd worry about the head gasket. You might check the carbs for varnish or dirt. I would also try to get some lube, like assy. lube, on the cam lobes. I would also not fire it up till I got oil pressure.

Can't wait to see some pics! Let us know if you need help with that.

Good luck!

What he said

It would be worth getting a bore scope and having a look down the bores as well. Hopefully there's no rust in there, but if there is, it won't end well.

Scuse my ignorance, but what's an Else engine?
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Monday,July 13, 2015, 03:47:47 PM
Good suggestion on the bore scope!

Quote
Scuse my ignorance, but what's an Else engine?

It's NOT an ELISE engine! I misread that name on another thread!  :-[
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: LotusJoe on Monday,July 13, 2015, 04:31:48 PM
Strawberry cheesecake,
Here is the link to Else engine

http://www.lotus-europa.com/literature/ElseEuropa.pdf (http://www.lotus-europa.com/literature/ElseEuropa.pdf)
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Tuesday,July 14, 2015, 06:32:53 AM
All the advice so far has been to fit the "new" engine as the Else is a bit highly strung.   I will be selling the Else engine for parts once I know for certain that the "new" engine  is good. 
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: StrawberryCheesecake on Wednesday,July 15, 2015, 10:52:45 AM
Strawberry cheesecake,
Here is the link to Else engine

http://www.lotus-europa.com/literature/ElseEuropa.pdf (http://www.lotus-europa.com/literature/ElseEuropa.pdf)

Thanks Joe - I saw it on the other thread.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,July 23, 2015, 02:04:12 PM
The lotus heritage chap has advised me that the brand new engine (a present from Colin chapman) is a federal 1500 Renault engine.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: LotusJoe on Thursday,July 23, 2015, 02:18:24 PM
The lotus heritage chap has advised me that the brand new engine (a present from Colin chapman) is a federal 1500 engine.
1500 Twin Cam or Renault?
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,July 24, 2015, 07:54:56 AM
Took the radiator and oil cooler to our local specialist today expecting a hefty bill.  Apparently both in excellent condition passed pressure test with flying colours, cleaned, re painted and looking like new £20.  I hope I have many more such bargains, but I doubt it ....
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Friday,July 24, 2015, 07:56:59 AM
It sure is nice to pay less than you expected, isn't it!  :beerchug:

I hope your good fortune continues!
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Friday,July 24, 2015, 09:18:34 AM
Took the radiator and oil cooler to our local specialist today expecting a hefty bill.  Apparently both in excellent condition passed pressure test with flying colours, cleaned, re painted and looking like new £20.  I hope I have many more such bargains, but I doubt it ....

£20 ?  I must have spent more than that on bandages, plasters and anaesthetic (beer) when I did mine.....  bargain !!!!!   
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,July 26, 2015, 08:45:28 AM
Fantastic service from my friend Max who has a vapour blaster, which cleans parts with absolutely no surface damage at all.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,July 26, 2015, 08:47:04 AM
4 branch manifold blasted and painted with UHT
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,July 26, 2015, 08:47:55 AM
Fuel pump vapour blasted and serviced.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,July 26, 2015, 08:48:56 AM
Rocker box painted with wrinkle finish.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,July 26, 2015, 08:51:43 AM
Beautiful finish with wrinkle paint.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: 4129R on Sunday,July 26, 2015, 10:07:43 AM
A work of art.

WTF is a vapour blaster? Something from Star Trek?
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Sunday,July 26, 2015, 12:31:34 PM
4129R, here's an explanation of vapor blasting: http://www.arnoldsdesign.com/Vapor-Blastin.html

Gmg31, those look really nice! She'll be a beauty when you're done!
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,July 27, 2015, 02:50:24 AM
That link says it all.  My friend Max showed me the machine in action and it is a joy to behold.  large blast cabinet with high pressure water, air and tiny glass beads. the finish is amazing.  Not sure if I'll get into trouble for advertising but if you want to check it out its Romax on Ross Road Stockton -on-Tees.  I still have another batch to pick up but I've had 2 boxes of stuff done and it cost me £55 for the lot.  I'll post pictures of the next batch when it arrives. 
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,July 27, 2015, 12:42:00 PM
My first bit of bad luck tonight. Turns out the radiator I got with this project is n't the correct one. Shame I spent money having it pressure tested, cleaned and painted. The guy from Motorcool has worked there for 40 years and told me it looked like it was off a Woolsey, now I know why.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: buzzer on Wednesday,July 29, 2015, 06:54:49 AM
Bad luck on that one, there will be more I am sure!  but keep going.
My recent challenges, got a non std flywheel that can't take a 8.5" clutch, that's balanced with the crank. fortunately Richard at Banks Engineering has sorted me a smaller comp clutch to do the job. I have an odd rear hub.... missing odd little parts and now looks like the new cams I have had put in the head appear not to be ground properly (differential on valve timing between 1,4 and 2,3), which I am now investigating. Oh the joys of restoration!

Dave
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropatcSPECIAL on Wednesday,July 29, 2015, 10:08:18 AM
 :Welcome: Gmg31  Looks like a cracking project
all the best
Stuart
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,August 03, 2015, 01:16:49 PM
Sent of my carb and manifold to be recon, what a fantastic service
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,August 03, 2015, 01:20:59 PM
Full restoration Superb finish, £125 for the carb and £40 for the manifold
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Monday,August 03, 2015, 04:19:28 PM
That's really pretty!  :beerchug:
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Tuesday,August 04, 2015, 08:49:24 AM
This guy has been very good, quick service, loads of advice and affordable.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: buzzer on Thursday,August 06, 2015, 07:58:25 AM
Hmm,

Think I'll give the guy a ring. lovely job.

Dave
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,August 23, 2015, 10:38:45 AM
I needed some early results to keep my enthusiasm up  so I've started doing some prep work on the interior. Fully restored and cleaned seats
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Sunday,August 23, 2015, 02:16:21 PM
They look great! Upholstery is just one of the things I would never consider attempting...
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Sunday,August 23, 2015, 10:20:57 PM
Wow, they look good.

Were they good enough just to clean up or is that a home re-trim ?  If so, you have a real talent there.

Brian
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,August 24, 2015, 12:47:37 PM
A mix of both, the rear of one seat was rusted through and needed re fabricating.  4 of the pads needed new sponge and rear boards but all of the vinyl was in good condition. The hardest part was cleaning the basket weave it is so difficult to clean out all the little crevices.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,August 24, 2015, 12:55:48 PM
Such a frustrating day today. This car has stood for 35 years and every bolt is seized or corroded.  I had to take an angle grinder to the U bolts and brackets today to free off the steering rack.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,August 24, 2015, 12:59:15 PM
And then one of the wheel nuts sheered off
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Monday,August 24, 2015, 01:06:46 PM
ouch, that looks nasty, but sometimes you just aren't going to get things done without brute force.   If the car is as rust-bound as that then I think I'd just invest in a few slitting discs for the grinder and give up trying to salvage the nuts and bolts.

If there's no petrol around then it might be worth trying a propane torch to see if you can shake them, but they take so much bashing to get them off it's questionable if you'd want to use them in critical areas anyway.

Brian

edit to add - and the wheel nut looks even worse !  I think this is what's called "in at the deep end" or "baptism of fire" on the grand scale of Lotus restoration. On the plus side - that must be so dispiriting that things can only get better !
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: jbcollier on Monday,August 24, 2015, 05:05:44 PM
Very common to over torque the Europa/Spitfire wheel nuts, damaging the threads.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: buzzer on Thursday,August 27, 2015, 05:07:07 AM
propane torch by itself cannot give enough focused heat. I would use one of these oxygen/gas welding torches. they are great pieces of kit. you can focus the heat on the parts you want and there is a much better chance of getting the bit apart rather than hacking it with a cutting disc.

http://www.weldingshop.co.uk/diy-hobbyist-c-139/oxyturbo-110-gas-welding-kit-p-377.html?zenid=d4d51b2a04ff5e52245be96bc2486bfe

great hobby gas welding kit, not particularly cheap but if you have to buy new brackets for the steering rack and other brackets you will save the money. I bought one earlier this year and wish I'd done it sooner!


Dave
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,August 28, 2015, 01:48:08 PM
Well it turns out my car has 1 extra bolt on top of the tunnel bolted directly into the backbone.  Even Richard didn't know about this bolt!! So eventually the shell is off and going to paint next week. The body shop is happy to take 2 months to do the work which gives me time to restore the chassis brakes and suspension.

  I have been a bit disappointed with the quality of the "out of sight" fibre glass even on this replacement shell. So I purchased a huge bucket of gel coat and I've been painting it on all the internal unfinished surfaces before going to paint.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Friday,August 28, 2015, 03:05:57 PM
Glad you finally got it separated!

I wouldn't complain too much about the fiber glass quality. It seems to me that it was better in the Elan and S2 than the TC, but people who have more direct experience with them may disagree, but the glass on my TC that didn't show was of varying quality. Part of the floor in front of the front trunk was thin, it wasn't well finished in the engine compartment, and, of course, the boot, bonnet, and doors don't fit all that well.

Keep in mind that you're dealing with a Lotus.  :)
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Grumblebuns on Friday,August 28, 2015, 03:59:23 PM
  I have been a bit disappointed with the quality of the "out of sight" fibre glass even on this replacement shell. So I purchased a huge bucket of gel coat and I've been painting it on all the internal unfinished surfaces before going to paint.

I would go easy on the application of the extra resin, go thin as is reasonable. Some one in the past applied several coats/layers of fiberglass and resin to the rear and front deck lids of one of my Europas in an effort to stiffen the panels. I haven't weighed the deck lids but I swear, both weigh at least 10 pound extra apiece!!!.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,August 29, 2015, 07:45:22 AM
I've put a couple of coats of gel coat in the front compartment and the side walls of the engine bay and the finish is so much better now.  Hoping when it goes to paint they will be able get a decent finish in those areas or I might use smooth yellow Hammerite with a roller.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: buzzer on Saturday,August 29, 2015, 10:53:52 AM
 I am not sure about using hammerite as I think it is quite in-flexible and will flex and expand differently to the fibreglass or rather not flex at all.

Dave
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: jbcollier on Saturday,August 29, 2015, 01:30:59 PM
Gel coat/resin alone will crack over time.  A couple of layers of veil cloth first is a better idea.  The best idea to to relax and not worry about it.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,September 02, 2015, 01:08:13 PM
Big day today, very much spoilt by 3 companies who agreed to move my shell the 2 miles to the body shop and then changed their minds last minute. Thanks to Mr Shifter for stepping in at the last minute.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,September 02, 2015, 01:09:07 PM
Chassis ready for restoration
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,September 02, 2015, 01:10:43 PM
Finally managed to release the wheel that was seized to the nut. Some damage but a local specialist is happy to assist.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,September 02, 2015, 01:12:10 PM
Both fuel tanks are knackered. This 0% credit card is taking some knocks.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,September 05, 2015, 11:54:42 AM
Stripped down the chassis this week.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Saturday,September 05, 2015, 02:10:48 PM
It looks like you're making a good start!

Keep those pictures coming, please!

 :lotus:
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,September 11, 2015, 12:59:33 PM
Big day today, the last of the noisy dirty days.  Every part has been jet washed, sandblasted or ground.  From next week each piece will be painted, powder coated or polished and re fitted.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Friday,September 11, 2015, 01:13:13 PM
Looks kind of rough now but I'm sure it will look really spiffy soon!

Keep up the great work!

 :lotus:
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: 3929R on Sunday,September 13, 2015, 10:32:26 AM
Congratulations! It's the prep that matters most but is the least gratifying to undertake.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Tuesday,September 15, 2015, 10:08:03 AM
Wheels came back today, wow.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Tuesday,September 15, 2015, 10:20:16 AM
They did a great job! They'll look great on your car!
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Tuesday,September 15, 2015, 01:14:37 PM
And you're going to put them on a car and drive it in the rain through muddy puddles ?   :huh:

Excellent job there, you've got to be pleased with that one.

Brian
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Tuesday,September 15, 2015, 01:28:03 PM
I have no idea which one was damaged, the repair is absolutely superb.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,September 20, 2015, 10:03:52 AM
Finished painting the chassis yesterday and fitted the sound proofing today
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,September 26, 2015, 11:22:08 AM
I built up the engine today, just for photos,
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Nick in Beds on Sunday,September 27, 2015, 02:17:52 AM
That looks very nice indeed!

Who do the toes belong to in the first picture?  :) ;)
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,September 27, 2015, 11:11:52 AM
The toes belong to her indoors, she got very excited when I started talking about planning a marriage this weekend. I meant fitting the engine to the chassis.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,September 27, 2015, 11:17:40 AM
One of the advantages of stripping down the chassis is that refitting the engine is a doddle.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: StrawberryCheesecake on Sunday,September 27, 2015, 02:18:01 PM
Looks like you're cracking on with it - have you got a target completion date in mind?
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,September 27, 2015, 02:49:50 PM
Still aiming for Easter. 10 months full nut and bolt restoration whilst having a full time job is quite a challenge but I'm exactly where I wanted to be. I want all the suspension and brakes back on the chassis by the end of October ready for the body to come back. That then gives me 4 months for wiring and interior.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Sunday,September 27, 2015, 06:44:51 PM
That's a pretty aggressive schedule! Good luck! You're going to need it with that beautiful distraction you have!

Best to you both!
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,September 28, 2015, 03:42:37 AM
Well spotted, you are correct that Elan m100 certainly is a beautiful distraction  :huh:
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Monday,September 28, 2015, 05:32:28 AM
You may be in more trouble than I thought!  :))
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: 3929R on Monday,September 28, 2015, 06:38:57 PM
Beautiful! She's coming along well!
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: blasterdad on Monday,September 28, 2015, 07:14:58 PM
 :I-agree:
Great work, I can't find the time to even put the new carb on mine.... :'(
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,October 04, 2015, 10:46:20 AM
Good and bad news this weekend.  I decided to put some oil in and connect up the starter motor, take out the plugs and turn the engine over. So two problems, the starter motor wasn't engaging the fly wheel and was just spinning. Not sure why. And the sump plug was leaking terribly. Unfortunately it turns out the sump plug was cross threaded and wouldn't go in or out. Fortunately the shell is still away so it was restively easy to remove the engine but removing the sump left a colossal oily mess on my garage floor. Fortunately I have a spare engine and sump phew.
Title: Re: Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,October 08, 2015, 06:07:49 AM
So I discovered a fault with my sump at the weekend, there was a damaged thread in the block (despite it being a brand new unused engine).    Initially I was quite annoyed but realised that had I finished the restoration this would have been a much bigger problem.  With no body shell in place it was relatively easy to remove the engine again from the chassis. I inserted a tap to cut a new thread but unfortunately I appear to hit the back of the hole and snapped the tap off in the hole.  although a tap is very brittle and snaps easily they are impossible to drill out because the steel is harder than the drill.  After a few calls I discovered 3D tooling in Stockton who had no hesitation is happily accepting the job and no doubt they could fix it.  Apparently the effected part is submerged in a waxy paraffin solution and an electric arc erodes the tap without marking the aluminium. Sounds like wizardry to me but here's a link to better understand it.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrical_discharge_machining

Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,October 15, 2015, 04:28:11 AM
Anyone following this story will know that I had been lead to believed that my car had been re shelled in approx 1981.  I assumed that meant a new shell but my body shop has done some exploratory work and it looks like this was a "pre enjoyed" shell.  The body was originally green, then red, followed by brown and then White.  The car is about to be soda blasted before being sprayed Lotus yellow next month.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: 3929R on Thursday,October 15, 2015, 08:12:23 AM
The car is about to be soda blasted before being sprayed Lotus yellow next month.
Or continue the spot sanding and you'll have a très chic tie dye Europa. I look forward to pictures after the spray!

(https://chivethethrottle.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/image38.jpg)
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Thursday,October 15, 2015, 08:59:11 AM
it looks like this was a "pre enjoyed" shell.

 :FUNNY: 

Now that bought quite a chuckle.   Love the phrase "pre-enjoyed".......

Brian     
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: buzzer on Thursday,October 15, 2015, 09:06:52 AM
That sound quite an expensive solution. I wonder what the cost is.
As you seem to have good access to the block you could use some of the following.
The things I would try is
Some sharp hammer taps on the  centre of the tap might loosen it and then grip it to undo it
use a gas welding torch to heat the tap up, you should be able to get it red hot and cycle heating it may soften the tap or loosen it. if you have access to a gas welding torch
grind out the centre of the tap with a dremel bit or grind a flange so you might be able to grip the tap
use a diamond or special drill to drill out the centre.

If you cant recover the thread to Helicoil the block. simple job, you can buy the kits of eBay to £10 especially for metric threads,

I ground out the centre of a snapped easy out (manifold stud problem and an easy out is about the same hardness as a tap) with a dremel and special hardened drill on an alloy rover V8 unit with the engine in the car and didn't need to helicoil

Dave

Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,October 16, 2015, 03:09:20 AM
That sound quite an expensive solution. I wonder what the cost is.

Dave

Thanks for your tips Dave.  I had tried a few but I really didn't want to risk making this worse.
 
"A man must Know his limitations"

So it went off to 3D Tooling and they brought it back on Tuesday all fixed with a M8 Thread.  It cost £120 which I thought was good value for piece of mind. 
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,October 16, 2015, 03:20:30 AM
So once the log book came back I was able to learn the name of the original owner of this car.  The story I had was that he was a friend of Colin Chapman.  I knew he had sadly died earlier this year so a bit of googling identified the solicitor dealing with his estate.  I wrote a letter to the family and emailed it to their solicitor.   Well I had a reply within hours and included in the email was some original photos of the car from the early 70s.  It turns out that the original Owner, Mr F, was at university with Mr Chapman in the 40s.  He became a Dr and later a Cardiovascular specialist.  The engine that Mr Chapman  gave him for his restoration was a federal development engine.  See below 40 yr old photo

Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Friday,October 16, 2015, 05:55:42 AM
Knowing that history and having documentation is really cool! That's really special!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,November 07, 2015, 03:14:14 PM
So I went to see my shell today.  It's been at a media blast specialists for a couple of weeks being gently soda blasted. The deal with the body shop was he would re assess the project once we knew what was under the paint. Well the answer is 40 year old fibre glass with little or no gel coat and Loads of body filler & bodge. It looks terrible and the paint shop ain't gonna touch it. So....I was going to rent a storage unit for the élan for winter but given the current situation I've decided to rent an industrial unit for 6 months instead that will give me the space to lay up the élan and do the bodywork on the Europa over winter.  I'm planning to read everything and watch YouTube videos about spraying cars and by spring I'll be ready to paint her.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,November 07, 2015, 03:17:01 PM
Very patchy with virtually no gell coat and loads of bodge
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Saturday,November 07, 2015, 06:57:36 PM
I'm not a paint specialist. I've only painted one car - my MG Midget race car many years ago. From what I've seen, fiberglass does present some unique issues, but I don't know why this guy wouldn't paint your car. I didn't have any gel coat on my car. I covered the doors, boot, and bonnet with gauze myself. The car had some body filler but the body was pretty flat when I took it to the paint shop. They had no trouble painting it and it came out great! Have you seen the Overhaulin video about our own 7upJohn's car (this is part 2 where they paint the car: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4AGknF9L-O8). They didn't spray his car with gel coat and it came out stunning! You might want to find another paint shop.

Doing it yourself is certainly not impossible but you'll get better results from a professional setup with a paint booth, etc. As I say, it's been a long time since I painted a car so I don't know how it is to work with the latest polyurethane paints, which is what I would expect you would want to use. When I painted my race car, I use enamel but lacquer is MUCH easier to paint and repair boo boos. Back then, it also gave a better finish - especially after many hand rubbed coats!

Good luck and let us know what you do.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Saturday,November 07, 2015, 11:27:29 PM
It's very hard to tell from photos, but my initial impression is that your car looks normal to me. The only concern I would have is that I can't make out if the front panel is showing a pale yellow gel coat or a roughened finish because the blasting has removed all the top layer.  But apart from that, the rest looks pretty much standard to me. Perhaps the real reason is that your paint shop just doesn't want the job, painting Fibreglass is a much more involved process than simply welding on new steel panels and throwing paint on.

It's a few years since I did my Europa (2011) but I did the Elan in 2013 and took more pictures. Here's a couple showing the general finish I had, including a repaired front section that was badly fitted many years ago and after several attempts to stop it flexing over the years, I finally bit the bullet and sorted it out properly.

The first 2 shots are general, part way through preparation. The grey/white areas you see aren't gel coat, it is the remains of the polyester spray filler I used for the 90's respray. But you get the idea, the appearance is very scruffy at this stage. The key thing through is that it's smooth - ignore what it looks like and trust your fingertips to find faults in the surface.

The wing repair shows that it had just been stuck on some time in the 70s with filler and pop rivets, and not surprisingly 6 months after painting it would start to show cracking along that line. The later image shows the original gel coat which should be glass like but often isn't because it's very thin in places on my car. Don't worry too much but if glass fibres are poking through then they do need sealing otherwise they absorb moisture and will give problems later on.

A good starter book is Miles Wilkins "How to restore paintwork", #4 in the Osprey series. Out of print but often on Ebay for a couple of quid. He's also done one about fibreglass in the same series but for some reason that sells for silly money. You don't need it, there are other guides around equally good, but the paintwork one is worth buying. Dated information but lots of pictures and sound advice relevant to our cars.

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: buzzer on Sunday,November 08, 2015, 01:22:31 PM
It is difficult to see from the photos, but it looks like not all the paint has been removed. Remember the lotus gel coat is clear so you can see the fibreglass strands through it as in the picture of your nose. It can be difficult to see if you are through the gel coat, but if you expose strands of fibreglass you know you have no gel coat!
A lot of body shops have no idea how to handle fibreglass so no surprised about the comment. Working with fibreglass is not particularly difficult but it is time consuming. Read up on it and get stuck in!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: StrawberryCheesecake on Monday,November 09, 2015, 02:02:20 AM
I wouldn't say I'm an expert, although I've painted a few of my own cars. I haven't decided how much of the paint I'll do on the Europa. I might do the interior, underside, and pay a 'proper painter' to do the top coat, as the car is worth a bit more than the others I've done, and it's going to be 3 different colours.

I have a barn next to a couple of guys who do a lot of bodywork on film cars, who are always helpful when it comes to advice.

Advice I've been given in the past is where a car has a fair bit of filler in it, is to leave it a while for the primer to settle- in case the filler sags. Priming and flatting it twice would help to get a good surface too. The film guys are in the middle of doing an old Bentley. Its 2nd application of primer was done and flatted back yesterday, but it will wait to be painted on Tuesday. There's not even much filler in it to settle - just being careful.

A pro body shop will see a risk of problems on a car like yours, which might mean they have to put a lot of hours into remedial work for no more money, or sits around taking up space in the workshop while it's left to settle.

Is the body badly cracked or does it look ok on that front?

I'm told you can get spray-on gel coat for marine use. Has anyone here used it on a car?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Tuesday,November 10, 2015, 02:15:09 AM
Thank you all for your advice and encouragement.  It turn out that my body shop had assumed that seeing the fibre glass meant that the gel coat was damaged or non existent.  He, like me, hadn't realised that the gel coat is clear.  So he has reconsidered the plan and we have decided to spray it with a couple of heavy coats of polyurethane.  Apparently this stuff is like spray filler and when it settles it can be flatted back to a much easier surface to work with.  Obviously I'll update when photos are available.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Tuesday,November 10, 2015, 05:22:58 AM
Great! That sounds like a plan!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: buzzer on Tuesday,November 10, 2015, 05:49:51 AM
It certainly does sound like a plan, good. Presume you have checked for cracking in the gel coat? Which WILL  show through after you have finished painting it as they will come back. Gel coat cracks can be difficult to see after you have removed the paint. They will show up as hairline cracks, I found by issuing a solvent based marker pen or a dye with acetone will show them up. Don't use water based product (well advise against it) as moisture can potentially get into the fibreglass.
Thats the right approach with polyester primer/filler,

By body is all primed up with polyester primer and I am fitting it out before I get it top coat painted.

Good luck Dave
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: LotusJoe on Tuesday,November 10, 2015, 12:12:55 PM
I used Duratec Surfacing Primer when I had my car painted. Paint is about 10 to 12 years old. Still holding up very well. My car was striped down to the gel coat and beyond in places.

http://www.fibreglast.com/product/Duratec_Gray_Surfacing_Primer_1041/Duratec?gclid=COry257UhskCFY-VfgodACwH9w

(http://cdn.fibreglast.com/images/uploads/912_199_large.jpg)

Sorry for the crappy picture
(http://www.lotuseuropa.org/gallery/albums/Zetec/body_on_03.sized.jpg)
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Tuesday,November 10, 2015, 11:43:30 PM
From a quick scan of the data sheet I think that's the same material I used Joe, but with a different name/supplier which isn't surprising I suppose as we're on opposite sides of the pond !

I'm not sure what's meant by "polyurethane" primer, I'm not in the painting game and don't keep up with things.  I have seen the term associated with water based paints so I think I'd ask around and see if the usual GRP painting specialists use it. It could well be the modern generation primer and ideal for the job, it's just new to me.

The generic term for what I used is polyester spray filler, the same material as Buzzer used from his post. It's basically resin with filler and sets by chemical reaction rather than solvent evapouration, which is what a lot of older "high build" primers used to do and they were the ones that used to sink after a few months. The brand I used was U-Pol Reface which has been around in the UK for a long time now.

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: LotusJoe on Wednesday,November 11, 2015, 05:21:06 AM
Duratec is a Polyester Surfacing Primer. I was made aware of the material from a Corvette restoration shop.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,November 11, 2015, 03:53:30 PM
Thank you all for this advice.  I really appreciate your help.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,November 11, 2015, 03:56:12 PM
Tonight was quite a special moment.  I refitted the recon steering rack, only a tiny step I know, but it's the first part (after the engine) to be refitted to the chassis.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Wednesday,November 11, 2015, 04:07:31 PM
Baby steps! Congratulations on your progress! Keep it up!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,November 13, 2015, 12:43:47 PM
This car had been upgraded to Spax at some point in the 70 but hadn't turned a wheel since 79 so they were in great shape with a little surface rust. I stripped them down and had them sandblasted. The springs were powder coated and the dampers painted.  But wow how hard is it to put these back together. I eventually found a local garage who used a hydraulic press and only charged me £20.  However it's impossible to get them back together without damaging the paint finish. So all of the suspension components are now fully reconditioned and I start refitting it next week.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Friday,November 13, 2015, 12:59:01 PM
Pretty! Those front springs ar the stock size. I can't tell if your spax are like mine but I was able to use the same diameter springs on the front and back.

The front springs, as you found out, are preloaded in compression but don't remember that the back one are (maybe just for the TC?). A spring compressor fabricated out of two squares of plate steel or aluminum, threaded rod, nuts and washers is all you need to install the fronts, but then you got past that, didn't you?  :)

Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,November 13, 2015, 02:51:00 PM
The problem is that the springs are so small and need to be completely compressed In order to fit the collet. No spring compressors would fit.  I did see a great photo on here from a Guy who used ratchet stamps.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Nick in Beds on Saturday,November 14, 2015, 02:25:44 AM
I must have seen that picture as it gave me the idea to use ratchet straps on mine - normal spring compressor too big - motorcycle one too small!!

Your units look excellent by the way  :)
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: jbcollier on Saturday,November 14, 2015, 06:35:28 AM
Motorcycle shops have spring compressors that work on Europa shocks as well.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,November 15, 2015, 09:43:22 AM
Changed the oil seals on the gear box this weekend. If you haven't done this job it is essential to buy Richard's special tool and listen to his advice before starting.  It's harder than you think it's going to be
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Sunday,November 15, 2015, 10:18:20 AM
Just an FYI for those of us on this side of the pond: r.d. enterprises has a similar tool if you need it.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,November 22, 2015, 03:05:41 AM
Sorry if you've seen this elsewhere but I needed to add it the full story
My luggage bay had been lined with horrible brown nylon fabric at some point.  It was ripped and tatty when I bought the project and even after I removed it all the finished surface was very uneven and tatty.  So I took it to my friendly re trimmer and he lined the sides with basket weave which hides the uneven surface. He then made me a removable padded base and added yellow piping to match the paint.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,November 22, 2015, 03:06:51 AM
Close up
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,November 22, 2015, 03:08:10 AM
And a matching padded base for the plenum chamber
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: 4129R on Sunday,November 22, 2015, 06:17:29 AM
Where did you get the oil seals from?

I have gearboxes with the castleated alloy ring nut broken. Any ideas where to get replacements from?

Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,November 22, 2015, 09:28:50 AM
I got mine from Richard at Banks. It's really important to ask him about the job because there are a couple of essential do & do nots.

http://www.banks-europa.co.uk/cars_home.htm
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,November 22, 2015, 01:50:00 PM
Well this weekend saw the start of phase 3, starting to put this massive puzzle back together.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Sunday,November 22, 2015, 02:13:52 PM
Looking good!  :welder:
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,November 27, 2015, 03:48:27 PM
Mad panic this week, body shop has confirmed they are unwilling to paint my shell despite its trip to the soda blasting shop.  So I've worked late every night to finish the chassis so I had somewhere to put the shell.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,November 27, 2015, 03:49:17 PM
A few more
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Friday,November 27, 2015, 11:05:30 PM
Now that's looking just too god to go out on our wet and salty roads !   I'm sorry to hear about your paintwork/bodyshop troubles, I can't help but wonder if they don't feel up to the job and rather than take it on, want to step sideways and away.

Do you have any other options at the moment ?  DIY resprays are possible and there are plenty of owners who have gone this route. It's a daunting task but if you just concentrate on one panel at a time rather than attempting the whole car at once, it's achievable.  It's unlikely you'll match a professional finish though, and given the amount of work you're doing on the mechanicals it's probably worth seeing if another restoration shop will take it on before taking the plunge yourself.

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Rosco5000 on Sunday,November 29, 2015, 07:02:11 AM
That is looking fantastic.  But that is frustrating that the body shop backed out. Do you have more options for body shops close to you?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Nick in Beds on Sunday,November 29, 2015, 08:00:20 AM
Far too nice to cover with the body !!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Sunday,November 29, 2015, 06:17:08 PM
I just can't believe that you couldn't find another good paint shop to paint your body! Hopefully you'll find one soon! In the mean time, your frame looks great!

 :lotus:
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,January 04, 2016, 11:08:11 AM
A full month of rest was required after a very busy November getting the chassis ready. So no progress photos to share but I recently received a batch of photos from the 70s kindly sent by the previous owners family.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,January 04, 2016, 11:11:30 AM
Following a garage fire in 1981  Mr F removed the damaged shell.  He never disposed of this shell and it sat here for another 35 years.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,January 04, 2016, 11:13:20 AM
The car was re shelled in 1981 but the project was never finished and she sat here unfinished for 35 years.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Monday,January 04, 2016, 01:13:47 PM
A great set of photos, just the thing to go into your restoration album.  I guess these days that fire damaged shell would appear on Ebay as a "suit enthusiast" project !

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Tuesday,January 05, 2016, 04:27:40 AM
The dealer I bough this off bought the yellow shell as well off the family and sold it so someone who was planning to use it for an "Audi Conversion".  I really don't know quite what he meant by that.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Bainford on Tuesday,January 05, 2016, 08:24:48 AM
 :coolpic: Very cool. It's great finding historic pics or info on a project car.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,January 08, 2016, 01:03:45 PM
A gentle start to the new year. I was a bit alarmed at how high I had to jack the shell but eventually I fitted the two new stainless fuel tanks.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,January 20, 2016, 04:59:00 AM
More delays.  I couldn't stop the N/S transaxle oil seal from leaking and had to remove the box again, lessons learnt.  but its back in again now and I can start putting this all back together again this week.  I've bought some sound deadening pads off ebay partly to smarten up the look of the engine bay. Photos to follow
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: jbcollier on Wednesday,January 20, 2016, 10:54:17 AM
Factory 1500 TC extremely rare.  Only used in the first 10 or so S1 Elans.  They were pulled from cars that came in for service and replaced with 1600 as Lotus wanted the 1500s for racing.

"1500 federal engine" = either a Renault 1470 high compression, 697-04 (which was sent to the US so could be construed as "federal"); or, more likely,  1565 normal compression, 821-30 engine that was used later.  Both have similar power outputs with the 1565 being slightly torquier and 1470 revving cleaner.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,January 22, 2016, 11:14:26 AM
That is correct this is an 821-30 engine
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,January 28, 2016, 01:26:41 PM
I normally strive towards originality but  I also value safety and when that is matched with something this pretty I couldn't resist this beautiful aluminium battery box.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Chuck Nukem on Thursday,January 28, 2016, 02:54:02 PM
Awesome! Did you make it?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: blasterdad on Thursday,January 28, 2016, 03:00:27 PM
 :I-agree:

It also matches the stove, sink, & the fuel tank! TRIPLE WIN!  :trophy:
Seriously though, that is cool!  8)
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropatcSPECIAL on Thursday,January 28, 2016, 04:35:06 PM
 That battery box looks the bees knees, could use one of them my self
looking good
 :pirate:
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Thursday,January 28, 2016, 05:00:48 PM
That battery box is pretty snazzy gmg31!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,January 29, 2016, 12:02:19 AM
I wish I could make stuff like that. It's from www.motorsport-tools.com it was only £44 the plastic ones from Demon Tweeeks were almost £60
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Naildriver on Friday,January 29, 2016, 09:52:51 AM
Great lead, thanks for the link. Ordered one already!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: blasterdad on Friday,January 29, 2016, 03:59:50 PM
Looking at around $100 dollars by the time it gets to the states, & they are currently out of stock of the standard size.  :P
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: andy harwood on Friday,January 29, 2016, 04:27:11 PM
give a search for dune buggy battery boxes.  quite a few for the odyssey & optima, and standard batteries, and in conus to boot.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,February 07, 2016, 11:15:57 AM
A good day today, most of the coolant hoses in place but really struggling with the hose that goes from the swirl pot down to the steel coolant pipe. Should there be another short steel pipe in there? Mine has a four branch exhaust manifold and the rubber hose that I've used goes so close ( about 10mm) it can't possible survive.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: jbcollier on Sunday,February 07, 2016, 01:54:34 PM
Plug rather than join the two outlets at the pump.  Make the RH one a bleed point.

Have an exhaust shop custom bend tubing to fit between the swirl pot and return pipe.  It's important the plain ends of the pipe have either a bead rolled or  four rivets around the circumference.  This prevents the cooling hose from being blown off under pressure.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,February 08, 2016, 05:02:23 AM
Thanks.  I was talking to Richard at Banks today and it looks like my coolant pipes have been cut short because of the 4 branch manifold and twin choke weber.  I'm having to have something manufacture so I'll mention that.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: 4129R on Monday,February 08, 2016, 08:12:45 AM
So it was you hogging the phone line this morning !
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,February 10, 2016, 09:15:18 AM
I've spent all day in my garage today and feel like I've achieved bugger all. This car is so frustrating it's impossible to just do a job once. I fitted the alternator and a bolt snapped. I fitted the cam pully and another holt snapped. Everything is so bloody fragile. Arggggg

rant over thank you.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Wednesday,February 10, 2016, 09:28:03 AM
I fitted the alternator and a bolt snapped. I fitted the cam pully and another holt snapped. Everything is so bloody fragile. Arggggg

hmmm, common theme here, is somebody having two shredded wheat for breakfast then ?    (old British advertisement joke for those across the pond... you have to have had a black & white telly to get it  ;)  )

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,February 15, 2016, 05:00:39 AM
So the week just got worse and I ended up with several set backs.  As mentioned  in another post my alternator was too long and I'm trying to source a smaller original one.  I also discovered that the coolant pipes were way too close to the 4 branch manifold so I've had to have a stainless steel pipe specially made to bypass the exhaust.  Then the final insult.....  Finally got power to the starter motor and a manual oil pressure gauge.  you may remember that this is a brand new but unused 37 year old engine that has never fired.  So before I get ahead of myself I cranked over the motor on the starter, without plugs,  to check for oil pressure. I was a bit concerned at first but eventually the pressure rose and I was very relieved, until I heard a small "pop".  Within seconds most of my oil was all over the garage floor and close inspection noted that the O ring had popped out of the oil filter.  This was the original filter (again 40 years old) that I was using as a temp measure but clearly that was a bad (and very expensive) decision.  It took me most of Saturday to clean up the mess what a horrible job.  btw my new filter seems to be too long and I can't fit it in because the chassis leg is in the way. What a week!! I think I need a rest.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: jbcollier on Monday,February 15, 2016, 08:08:43 AM
It's a mess but good news as it can be quite difficult to get a dry oil pump to suck oil -- and, after 30+ years, your pump would have been very dry.  Sounds like the oil filter was a little loose.  The proper filter is very short.  The same filter was used on many Renaults, just ask for one to suit a 1980 R5 with a 1.4 litre engine.

Again, good news about your engine's oil pressure!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Monday,February 15, 2016, 09:04:28 AM
A real mess, but as John says, really good news about the oil pressure! Hopefully, a new short filter and new oil will get you going!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: rascott on Monday,February 15, 2016, 10:23:15 AM
i had a similar problem w/a different vehicle(and may not apply in this case) when the oil pressure relief valve would stick closed.
blew the filter and pumped oil on cold start.
fantastic oil pressure until it ran out of oil, and that didn't take long.
i went thru a few filters(and did a couple of unintended oil changes) before figuring it out.
memory flash- had to mention.
richard
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: jbcollier on Monday,February 15, 2016, 02:28:38 PM
That's a possibility but, usually, you don't have enough engine speed while cranking to generate oil pressure sufficient to activate the oil pressure relief valve.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Tuesday,February 16, 2016, 01:42:59 PM
Thanks, I've not heard of the relief valve where us it please
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: jbcollier on Tuesday,February 16, 2016, 03:37:15 PM
Built into the oil pump.

http://www.lotus-europa.com/manuals/s1parts/e/e16.htm
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,February 17, 2016, 12:32:21 PM
Thank you.  I fitted the replacement filter tonight and topped up the missing 4 pints grrr.  Spun her over and pressure is back up.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Wednesday,February 17, 2016, 01:36:31 PM
 :beerchug:
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,February 19, 2016, 12:51:28 PM
After several frustrating weeks I've finally managed to fit an original alternator.  I've posted another story about the problems I've had.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Friday,February 19, 2016, 01:03:33 PM
Now that's a tiny alternator! What was it originally intended for?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,February 19, 2016, 01:06:56 PM
That is the correct original.  See my other post on "alternator problems."
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,February 19, 2016, 03:21:29 PM
I love the finish that you get from vapour blasting.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,February 20, 2016, 10:58:23 AM
front compartment painted. New radiator, hoses and master cylinder.  Plenum chamber painted, air intakes vapour blasted. New upholstered insert
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,February 28, 2016, 10:48:20 AM
Well I had a terrible week this week. As mentioned in another post I accidentally damaged a brake pipe. Ironically I was cutting an inspection hatch to that I could see all the connections but slipped and sliced through the pipe that goes from the LR to the RR via the V in tha chassis.  I originally decided to buy a hand held brake pipe flanging kit so I could repair the pipe. However once I had separated  the shell from the chassis (again) I realised it was easier to just replace it. However, "Easier" does not realy describe it.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,February 28, 2016, 10:50:01 AM
The only way into the space was to drop the chassis about 30 cm and lie on the engine whilst reaching along the chassis.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Sunday,February 28, 2016, 01:19:22 PM
Another LOTUS position!  :FUNNY:
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: 3929R on Monday,February 29, 2016, 11:22:30 AM
Is ELSE now bruised onto your chest?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,March 02, 2016, 02:45:42 PM
I did put a blanket on the top but it was very uncomfortable.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,March 20, 2016, 11:43:20 AM
I'm guessing this seat belt anchor is no longer fulfilling its primary objective.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Sunday,March 20, 2016, 12:16:38 PM
I think you're right. That anchor is a prime candidate for a replacement!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Sunday,March 20, 2016, 11:26:15 PM
I think it's called "adding lightness"   :)

Same thing with both of mine, that's on a '72 car. I'd bet most UK cars which have had daily use through winterat some point in their lives  will be in a similar state unless someone had made efforts to rust proof the parts, but they are in the "out of sight" category.  And not easily checked, I bet the average MoT tester doesn't even know how the belt is secured.

I think there is a slight fail-safe aspect though. The main section where the bolt goes was roughly 3"x1.5" and thicker on mine, probably 3mm as opposed to 1.5mm of the rest of the anchor. So it would have to pull through the fibreglass sill almost in shear for complete failure and if you had that much force across your chest it probably wouldn't be the main thing on your mind. 

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Grumblebuns on Tuesday,March 22, 2016, 08:18:40 AM
After several frustrating weeks I've finally managed to fit an original alternator.  I've posted another story about the problems I've had.

The picture of your engine bay solved one of the mystery of what intake manifold is on my S2. Apparently my manifold is a copy of the ELSE design. Mine is missing the ELSE logo with no other manufacturing stampings anywhere. Everything else (sorry, couldn't resist) I see in your photo is identical with mine.

While you're at this stage of the restoration, I highly recommend thinking of an effective heat shield to protect the Weber from heat soak along with an air box and a cold air intake. My S2 came with a air box made from two cake pans screwed together with an opening cut out on the bottom, directly above the exhaust header. This along with a relatively small heat shield below the Weber made for a frustrating drive in traffic with a bad stumble getting off the line until the carb cleared out.

I'm currently working on the issue. 
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,March 28, 2016, 11:59:35 AM
Thanks for that, I'll certainly consider it.  My biggest problem in that area has been re routing the coolant hose. The pipe coming from the chassis is far too close to the 4 branch exhaust manifold and the Webber sticks out so far that linking the pipe with the swirl pot has proved to be very frustrating.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Grumblebuns on Monday,March 28, 2016, 12:33:59 PM
People have re-routed the coolant line to the swirl pot around the front of the Weber.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,April 03, 2016, 11:50:17 AM

[/quote]



While you're at this stage of the restoration, I highly recommend thinking of an effective heat shield to protect the Weber from heat soak along with an air box and a cold air intake. My S2 came with a air box made from two cake pans screwed together with an opening cut out on the bottom, directly above the exhaust header. This along with a relatively small heat shield below the Weber made for a frustrating drive in traffic with a bad stumble getting off the line until the carb cleared out.

I'm currently working on the issue.
[/quote]

After this advice I have removed my carb and exhaust manifold and ordered some heat shield wrap. I've finished re routing the coolant hoses so hopefully I can put this all back together sometime this week. 
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Tuesday,May 03, 2016, 10:04:15 AM
Progress has been slow in recent weeks I've taken more things apart that I fitted months ago. But everything should start to come back together in the next few weeks.  The first part of this has been adding some heat insulation to the exhaust manifold and the arrival of the new silencer.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Tuesday,May 03, 2016, 03:06:56 PM
Gmg31,
Just an FYI here - You are supposed to start a quote with '
Quote
' and end it with '
' A simple way is to highlight and copy the text. Then when you are editing your post, click on the button under 'Font Size' between the '#' button and the bullet list button. Your cursor will be between a "
Quote
" and "
" and you can then just hit ctrl-V (on Windows machines. I'm not sure what it is on a Mac). Voila! Your text will be ensconced in a quote!  :beerchug:
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Tuesday,May 03, 2016, 11:58:24 PM
Unfortunately that doesn't seem to work quite so easily on my old IPad. .
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Wednesday,May 04, 2016, 05:28:24 AM
I'm sorry. I didn't look at the results of my post and it's a mess! And the part that is really messy is the part that would apply to you and your iPad. tried to fix it to no avail.

Let's see if this is any better:

Start a quote with open square bracket "quote" close square bracket and end it with open square bracket "/quote" close square bracket. You were starting the quote with the "end quote tag" so your tags were showing up in your post. I'm on my iPad and here's a fake quote:

Quote
some quoted stuff

That's what we're after! Now the beerchug  :beerchug:  :)
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,May 04, 2016, 12:45:20 PM
I realise this might ruffle a few feathers but one of the things I'm not keen on in the Europa is the minimalist open plan layout of the engine bay.  Obviously I know this was how they  "keep it simple and add lightness" but I wanted to add a separation between the engine and the fuel tanks.  Clearly a solid panel was out of the question so I went for these 2mm aluminium panels with 5mm perforations.  These were shaped to fit and I've just got them back from powder coating.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: blasterdad on Wednesday,May 04, 2016, 01:13:51 PM
No "feathers ruffled" here, I think it's a nice touch.
Looking forward to seeing them installed.  8)
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Wednesday,May 04, 2016, 01:34:17 PM
There are a few "originalists" but I think most, or at least many, of us make mods to personalize and improve our car. Looks good to me, too! Can't wait to see pictures!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Wednesday,May 04, 2016, 11:23:18 PM
Now that's a great idea. I think I shall steal it !   :)

The "original vs modifed" debate will always be around. Personally I like to see original cars but as many of you know, mine isn't although nothing I've done would take more than a spanner to revert to originality. 

It's a personal call and I justify it by thinking that if car makers always said "keep things original" then we'd never have had the S2 Europa or the TC. And if you think about it, the latter was another engine swap, not unlike the guys putting 4AGE engines in...

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,May 06, 2016, 01:08:18 PM
Fitted black heat and sound proofing on the bulk head a while ago but never really liked how it looked. So I sourced some gold heat shield. I made a brake Union inspection hatch from perforated aluminium today and fitted the first of the new perforated aluminium fuel tank separation panels.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,May 06, 2016, 02:23:12 PM
Starting to re fit the manifolds
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,May 11, 2016, 09:48:42 AM
Fitted the K&N filter today
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,May 11, 2016, 09:49:39 AM
Started work on the right hand side today
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: blasterdad on Wednesday,May 11, 2016, 05:57:16 PM
Carb looks great! It never occurred to me your panels could pull double duty as "parts pegboard".
Great idea!
 :coolpic:
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Wednesday,May 11, 2016, 06:42:52 PM
It's coming along very nicely, Gmg31!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,May 13, 2016, 09:24:55 AM
Having now installed some gold highlights in the engine bay I thought it best to powder coat the new battery box to match.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Friday,May 13, 2016, 12:40:08 PM
Very nicely done! The gold accents look great!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,May 16, 2016, 10:52:33 AM
Finished all of the ignition wiring today.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Monday,May 16, 2016, 11:10:53 AM
That looks really nice, Gmg31!! Very clean!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: 3929R on Tuesday,May 17, 2016, 08:21:16 AM
Your project is really starting to hit the home stretch. EXCITING!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,May 19, 2016, 02:17:26 PM
Started the engine tonight, first time this 36 year old engine has ever fired. Really difficult to set up the timing with no pully marks or any timing marks of any sort.  And then afterwards there was a small pool of oil on the floor. 1 step forward and two steps back.  Ho hum.  A bit of fine tuning this weekend.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Thursday,May 19, 2016, 05:44:43 PM
Congratulations! That's a great step forward! Don't you have marks on your flywheel (or is it different from the TC)?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Thursday,May 19, 2016, 10:21:02 PM
afterwards there was a small pool of oil on the floor. 1 step forward and two steps back.  Ho hum.  A bit of fine tuning this weekend.

only a small pool of oil ?   This is a Lotus we're talking about ?

  :)

Great news, I'd say it's all good progress, you'll soon sort it out now there's the incentive from a running engine.

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,May 30, 2016, 03:37:44 PM
So if you were following this on the other thread, you'll know that the little pool of oil turned out to be quite serious.  the head gasket was spitting oil out at the back so she has been stripped down again.  The rubber seal round the timing chain was twisted and the head gasket had been stuck back together with gasket sealant.  quick skim and valves re seated, new gaskets and all back together today and running by tea time.  A bit disappointed that none of the plug leads I bought last year were actually long enough so I had to use some old spares, but this meant rather poor running.  So it'll be a few days before I get her running smoothly
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Monday,May 30, 2016, 05:56:34 PM
I hope it all works out well! Please keep us informed!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,June 09, 2016, 01:46:58 PM
One of the other threads I started was about reinforcing the floor, based on the overhauling Europa.  In the end I  found a local specialist who recommended Combi matting which is 2 layers of glass fibre and a tightly woven mat all stitched together all bonded with Crystic resin.  So easy to use and absolutely rock hard. 
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Thursday,June 09, 2016, 02:24:03 PM
That should do it!  :beerchug:
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,July 02, 2016, 09:16:34 AM
So begins "operation learn to spray". I've spent the last week touching up the bodywork, no major issues and she's now all ready for primer.  I've just had a practice using filler primer. 
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: 4129R on Saturday,July 02, 2016, 09:51:39 AM
If you need help, ask the local vicar.

"Let us spray together".

You are a brave man taking that on.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Saturday,July 02, 2016, 10:39:53 PM
Go for it ! I'm not capable of producing top flight results but still find it a very rewarding job, much more so than any mechanical work.  There are always setbacks when you miss something but if your time is your own then you're going to get there in the end, everything is fixable !

If you don't have a gravity gun then take a look at them, the balance takes getting used to but on a DIY low output compressor I find them better to use. The other thing I've found handy is a small "touch up" gun, I think mine was £20 from Ebay. They are low output and meant for touching up panels but I find it very useful for painting in confined areas such as door shuts, etc, where full size guns at higher pressures are harder to control to get a nice finish.

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,July 03, 2016, 05:49:05 AM
That was certainly the advice form my local paint suppliers. 
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,July 03, 2016, 05:51:19 AM
Most of the body work is done now. Ready for primer.  There are so many panel lines and joints on the Europa it seems entirely feasible to paint it one panel at a time.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Sunday,July 03, 2016, 08:21:38 AM
 :)

Yep, that's the one !

Over the years I've collected 3 and have them set with different nozzles. I have one like that for final coats, a 1.7 which I use most of the time and a 2.2 for putting on the very thick spray fillers. The only advantage is that you can put thicker stuff on with the larger nozzles (I suppose that's obvious).

The small touch up gun is 1.0 nozzle and only takes thin paint, not much thicker than comes from an aerosol. To be honest I only got one recently and managed quite happily without for many years, so it's not an essential purchase.

I think you've got the right idea about one panel at a time, especially if it's your first go at it. Slow and steady and you'll have something to be proud of.

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: StrawberryCheesecake on Tuesday,July 05, 2016, 12:56:17 AM
So begins "operation learn to spray". I've spent the last week touching up the bodywork, no major issues and she's now all ready for primer.  I've just had a practice using filler primer.

Spray filler is very hydroscopic, so make sure you dry out the panels (space heater in your workshop) before painting.

Are you going for a solid colour in 2K paint?

With a lot of advice and help from the guys who spray film cars next to my barn, I've learned to paint reasonably well, and have sprayed big chunks of several cars now. the results are usually OK, with the odd re-do moment. The actual painting bit is the easiest part.

My painter neighbour on the barn tells me I need to use etch primer on fibreglass, and apart from that just paint as normal. Preparation, patience and a clean environment are keys to a successful finish.

Check the spray filler you used and check that it's compatible with etch primer. The stuff I've used isn't compatible.

Tips and tricks include (assuming you're not painting in a proper paint shop with extraction)
- put poly masking sheet across the roof to stop muck landing on the paint as it dries.
- wet the workshop floor with a couple of buckets of water to keep the dust down.
- Don't sand in the same place where you paint, if at all possible.
- Don't be tempted to sweep up just before you start painting - it takes ages for he dust to settle and it'll stick to the paint.
- Use damp proof membrane stapled round the door to block air gaps and reduce the number of flies and other beasties attracted to the light.
- Paint or seal the workshop walls and floor if they're not already done.
- Degrease the panels with panel wipe at least twice before you paint.
- Make sure the workshop is well lit. You'll need it to help see through the paint fog.
- Always start with a thin 'dust coat' of paint, and let it tack off till it's nearly dry, as it helps later coats stick and reduces the chance of a reaction.
- Learn how to mask a soft edge (fold over one side of the tape to make a flap, and don't try to paint right up to the edge - it'll find its way in anyway.
- If you're painting around rubber seals, run a piece of electrical cable under the seal to lift it, and avoid a hard line where you masked. It will reduce overspray onto the top of the rubber as well, but you can always remove that with a razor blade, and use a plastic filler spreader to protect the paint from the blade.

It'll take you more time than a pro painter, both in preparation and in flatting and polishing afterwards, but you can get good results.

If you've never painted before, practice on a sheet of primed steel, a spare panel, or even the rear deck lid, before you try the whole shell. Be prepared to strip it back and start again.

Don't do metallic for your first job, unless you like the idea of sanding it all off and starting again. Always spray a thin 'drop coat' to get an even flake finish, on the last coat of metallic. Don't do what I once did and run out of paint half way through the last coat, as you end up with a big 'stripe' in the metal flake :D
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,July 11, 2016, 03:13:08 PM
Thank you, some great advice there.  I practiced with ordinary primer on the rear wing and I thought it was a bit thin.  Even the tiniest imperfection was glaringly obvious.  So After some research I purchased this Upol high lift primer.  My car will eventually be yellow and apparently the absence of lead in modern yellow paint makes it a bit transparent so covering grey primer can often leave it looking a bit green.  This Upol is white and can also be tinted.  So I sprayed the front wings this weekend using a 2mm nozzle and the finish is amazing it's clearly quite thick and a little textured but it sands down easily and so far I'm really pleased.  My intention is to spray the rest of the car and then flat it down before another thinner tinted top layer of primer.   The Upol can be sprayed with differing viscosities and seems to be very easy to use. 
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Monday,July 11, 2016, 10:38:54 PM
Looking good.....

Is that a cellulose based primer or a 2-pack one ? If it's cellulose then leave it a long time before overcoating, the longer the better.   I'd be tempted to leave it at least a week before sanding to ensure it's settled.   2-pack paints tend to have better "hold out" against sinking 12 months later.

Yellow eh ? well, that's a good choice....   ;)   

I used 10L on my car if it's any use for guidelines over a final primer coat of white.  I don't know if it's the modern make-up of paints or not, but lighter colours haven't got the same covering power as something like red or black, so you end up needing a lot of paint.

Keep posting ! 
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,July 13, 2016, 04:03:16 PM
This is the key info
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Wednesday,July 13, 2016, 09:18:43 PM
 :)

That looks similar to the paint I've used although it's not the same manufacturer. IMO it's much better than the cellulose "high build primer" for hold out. I left mine overnight between coats and no complaints at all.  Good choice.

I apologise if you already know, but just in case because it is serious - are you using the proper filters when spraying this stuff ?   Plain dust filters aren't good enough and whilst doing the odd respray isn't going to kill you it can sensitise you over time and make you ill enough to decide it's not a good game.   Normally the advice is for fresh air breathing but you can get single use filters which normally last long enough for you to get a complete job done.

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: buzzer on Thursday,July 14, 2016, 01:24:42 AM
Yep, that's the stuff my painter used to prime my body. It is still in primer while I finish everything else.

Dave
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: StrawberryCheesecake on Thursday,July 14, 2016, 02:36:48 AM
:)

That looks similar to the paint I've used although it's not the same manufacturer. IMO it's much better than the cellulose "high build primer" for hold out. I left mine overnight between coats and no complaints at all.  Good choice.

I apologise if you already know, but just in case because it is serious - are you using the proper filters when spraying this stuff ?   Plain dust filters aren't good enough and whilst doing the odd respray isn't going to kill you it can sensitise you over time and make you ill enough to decide it's not a good game.   Normally the advice is for fresh air breathing but you can get single use filters which normally last long enough for you to get a complete job done.

Brian

What Brian said about filters (respirator masks) is absolutely right.

Ideally you should have an air fed mask, which needs a separate compressor setup. For those of us (including me) who don't have the luxury of that, then there are twin respirator masks by 3M and Gerson at about £15-20 with about a 40 hour life, if you put them back in the sealed packet when not in use (and probably other manufacturers) which keep the fumes out of your lungs, but 2k chemicals are still absorbed a bit through eyes and skin, so not an ideal solution for a pro painter, although I know pro painters who use them. Proper painting overalls and gloves are a good idea too. I've tried goggles but found it impossible to see properly with them. 

When you start sanding down the primer, do you know about guide coats (either powder or a thin dust coat of black cellulose paint, to show the high and low spots in the primer while you're sanding - don't use hammerite aerosol as it will react! Trust me on that one....)

A long board sander is a great thing for getting panels flat, although I don't suppose the fibreglass panels were all that flat when they came out of the factory...

A lumpy, textured finish is normal on high build primer... mix it a little thinner to flatten it a bit, or spray it a bit wetter, but you'll get runs instead, or won't get as much 'build' to cover imperfections.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Thursday,July 14, 2016, 09:36:24 AM
"Gerson" sounds familiar, the ones I used were 40hr life as well.  I wear specs so the plastic goggles are a real pain to wear and actually see what I'm doing so I plan the work to keep my exposure to a minimum.

I usually mix paint with the doors open and I've got windows that allow thru-flow ventilation so I don't smell the paint even without a mask.

Then I shut everywhere up, lights on, wipe the target panel(s) with a tack rag, don mask & start spraying. Once the gun is empty or I've done the panel(s) I've planned I switch off the compressor and walk outside. The exposure is probably less than 5 minutes total even if I'm doing a complete pass so if you plan carefully there's no need to get a lot of exposure to the overspray & clouds of fumes in there.

I leave it for ten minutes shut up, then crack the door and watch fumes flow out (we live well away from neighbours) and leave it for half an hour or so.  After that it's usually dry enough to open up fully and let everything disperse.  I would bet that I don't use 10 of the 40hrs available.....
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: StrawberryCheesecake on Friday,July 15, 2016, 06:39:47 AM
I'm normally spraying wet on wet with 2k solid or solvent base coat with 2k lacquer, but similar to Brian I don't hang about in between coats... I try to get out of the workshop, have a cup of tea, and go back in to hit it with the next coat when it's just tacky and no more.

Cracking the door is fine if it's not windy, and turn the lights off if you're painting after dark, to avoid encouraging wee beasties.

Most masks are designed to be used clean shaven, so bear that in mind. I've got a beard , but I seem to get a decent seal if it's not too bushy. If you get track marks of paint round your nose or jaw under the edges of the mask, then it isn't sealing very well.

This is the mask I use. I keep a running total of time used on the bag. It needs to go in the sealed bag when not in use, or the 40 hour clock keeps running. I generally throw them away long before 40 hours.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Gerson-2K-Paint-Respirator-Face-Mask-Smart-Repair-/152158445316?hash=item236d599f04:g:05kAAOSwDk5UExOn
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,July 15, 2016, 01:16:10 PM
Thanks everyone for your advice. I have purchased a respirator and pop in and out and crack the door open between coats.  I've also made a point of only doing 1 bit at a time so I don't build up clouds of fumes. I welcome your advice thanks
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: StrawberryCheesecake on Monday,July 18, 2016, 10:03:20 AM
To be honest, I do as much at once as I can. If you break the job up into little chunks, you end up spending longer painting, overall, and the finish won't be as uniform, with a slightly different mix on each area.

Keep up the good work.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,July 20, 2016, 08:23:51 AM
right now I'm playing with high build primer but yes I agree, when I do the final colour I will probably do it all in one go.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: StrawberryCheesecake on Sunday,July 24, 2016, 03:11:44 AM
Fair enough, but I think you still get less exposure overall, painting large areas rather than doing lots of little jobs.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,August 11, 2016, 11:12:03 AM
Finally got the whole car in primer
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Thursday,August 11, 2016, 12:30:48 PM
She looks great! That's an exciting development because putting the color on will be a big step!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,August 29, 2016, 12:50:51 PM
Had a bit of a practice today, painted all the door surrounds and the bonnet and boot shut zones.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Monday,August 29, 2016, 12:57:25 PM
Looks great! What are you going to paint the rest of the car?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: StrawberryCheesecake on Tuesday,August 30, 2016, 03:12:42 PM
Looking good so far. How are you finding it?

It might be that you've partially de-masked before you took the pics, but if I was being picky I'd advise masking off things like interior door handles, and avoid any exposed bodywork. If you're painting celly it's not so bad, but 2 pack has a nasty habit of sticking to things you don't want it to, and it's a pig to remove once it's hardened.

Any reason you didn't paint the tops of the door sills (step panel)?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,September 01, 2016, 01:32:14 PM
Yes I had de masked. You are right two pack is a pig to clean off later, as I'm learning.  So far I'm practicing on all of the none essential stuff whilst I get to grips with it all. There is a reason why I didn't do the sills but you're going to have to wait and see.  Tonight was the underside of the bonnet and boot. 
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,September 11, 2016, 10:40:36 AM
First attempt at painting a panel.  It looked great when I stopped but when I went back in the garage later the whole of the front of the Bonet had run.  Still on a very steep learning curve
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Sunday,September 11, 2016, 10:59:48 AM
First attempt at painting a panel.  It looked great when I stopped but when I went back in the garage later the whole of the front of the Bonet had run.  Still on a very steep learning curve
I think painting requires a lot more skill than it appears. I only painted one car - about 35 years ago. It came out pretty good, but it was no show piece. At the time, paint choices were pretty much between lacquer and enamel. Lacquer was easier because if you made a mistake, you could generally just buff it out. I have no idea what's required now for polyurethane paints. I imagine they are more unforgiving than lacquer.

Good luck!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Sunday,September 11, 2016, 10:05:11 PM
Oh I think you're doing just fine, a few paint runs are all part of the game. Leave it for a few days and then use 400/600 paper with very light pressure to take off the run. If you have a good depth of paint already I would be tempted to polish it (G3 cutting compound, T-Cut then polish) to see if it will polish out.

Everyone has their own trigger points when they stop adding paint. Mine is to put light passes which cover the panel with a solid colour and flash off quickly,  then finish off with a heavier coat. It generally looks a bit orange peel and "not enough" when I stop, but gravity and paint flow usually smooth it out well enough in the 4/5 minutes it takes the thicker coat to become tacky.

Final polish with T-Cut and sometimes G3 cutting compound is normal with me I'm afraid, I'n not good enough to get a mirror shine everywhere straight from the gun because I just don't do enough painting. And there are always the odd kamikaze fly and dust specs to remove as well !
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,October 08, 2016, 09:48:14 AM
Well the grand painting experiment  is over. In the words of Dirty Harry "A man must know his limitation". I'm very happy with the job I've done on all the door shuts the engine bay and the undersides of the engine cover and the bonnet. All the body work is done and the primer is good enough. So my friendly local body shop agreed to take the car and paint it for me for a very reasonable amount.  I've spent £6k just on parts so far and as my father would say, don't spoil the ship for a hapeth of tar. So I'm taking a rest for the next few months and hopefully I can post some updates in January. 

For our American friends a hapeth was half a penny about 100 years ago.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Saturday,October 08, 2016, 10:02:26 AM
Congratulations on your painting experiment! I wouldn't be at all ashamed of your end result. Having a shop do the bits that get the most eye balls is a reasonable way to go. I've always said that if my car looks good, it's because the paint and interior shops did a great job and most of the stuff I did was covered up with something!

I hope your extended rest isn't for an unfortunate reason!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,October 08, 2016, 04:01:08 PM
No not at all,  on the contrary it's good news.  The body shop has agreed to paint my car over the next few months and has promised it back by January.  During that period I'm moving to my new house.  Ignore the house but check out this garage.  The internal walls are simple stud walls so once removed I will have a work shop at the back, a stores dept in the conservatory and space for 4 cars in the main garage. My dream home.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Saturday,October 08, 2016, 05:11:35 PM
Glad to hear it! Looks like a great place to keep Loti!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,October 09, 2016, 10:39:37 AM
Before letting her go to the paint shop I decided to remove the dash and the instruments so I have something to do when she's away.  Wow that was a bit daunting but loads of labels and tape and hopefully I'll be able to get her back together next in January
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Sunday,October 09, 2016, 11:44:45 AM
You'll be fine! I don't remember it being that hard (no PO to mess things up), and if I can do it, I know you can!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: StrawberryCheesecake on Wednesday,October 26, 2016, 06:00:59 PM
Oh I think you're doing just fine, a few paint runs are all part of the game. Leave it for a few days and then use 400/600 paper with very light pressure to take off the run. If you have a good depth of paint already I would be tempted to polish it (G3 cutting compound, T-Cut then polish) to see if it will polish out.

Everyone has their own trigger points when they stop adding paint. Mine is to put light passes which cover the panel with a solid colour and flash off quickly,  then finish off with a heavier coat. It generally looks a bit orange peel and "not enough" when I stop, but gravity and paint flow usually smooth it out well enough in the 4/5 minutes it takes the thicker coat to become tacky.

Final polish with T-Cut and sometimes G3 cutting compound is normal with me I'm afraid, I'n not good enough to get a mirror shine everywhere straight from the gun because I just don't do enough painting. And there are always the odd kamikaze fly and dust specs to remove as well !

What he said, but if you're moving house, you've got enough on your plate.

You can use a layer of stopper round a paint run to help sand the run back without going through the good paint.

No matter though. The paint shop should be able to finish it for you while you work on the man cave at the new house.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,November 20, 2016, 10:44:00 AM
Further to link about dashboards.  I filled the holes and trimmed the plywood with black vinyl.  The crash pads are being professional retrimmed with grey vinyl.  I'm servicing the gauges.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,November 20, 2016, 10:45:44 AM
The car has come back from the paint shop and is looking stunning.  No full shots yet but here are a couple of previews.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Sunday,November 20, 2016, 11:27:05 AM
She's coming together nicely! Can't wait to see more pictures!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: lotusfanatic on Sunday,November 20, 2016, 11:18:36 PM
She looks fantastic!
I'm looking forward to seeing the full shots  :)

Mark
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,November 24, 2016, 02:47:39 PM
Another little preview
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Thursday,November 24, 2016, 03:07:33 PM
I like the Elan Sprint-esque paint scheme!

 :lotus:
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: lotusfanatic on Thursday,November 24, 2016, 10:59:43 PM
now THAT is a teasing photo!

I look forward to seeing the rest of the car  ;D

Mark
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Certified Lotus on Friday,November 25, 2016, 04:33:35 AM
Nice! Do you have the paint code for the yellow you used?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,November 25, 2016, 08:29:34 AM
LO 7 Lotus yellow.  That was the original colour but at some point the car was re shelled with a white shell so to represent the history of the car I chose the classic Elan Sprint colour scheme so she could be both colours.  Gold bumpers to be fitted this weekend more photos to follow if it doesn't rain   
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Bainford on Friday,November 25, 2016, 09:16:53 AM
Very nice! The Sprint inspired paint scheme fits well. Can't wait to see more.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Certified Lotus on Friday,November 25, 2016, 12:50:27 PM
I went to a professional paint shop here in the states and gave them all the various paint codes for Lotus Yellow. Nothing came up on the computer. The original paint was a lacquer based paint which isn't available anymore. Do you know what brand was used and the code?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,November 26, 2016, 01:52:26 AM
I'm sorry I don't. I just went to a paint supplier and asked for it. It's a two pack paint and they had no problems mixing it.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: blasterdad on Saturday,November 26, 2016, 06:01:37 AM
I went to a professional paint shop here in the states and gave them all the various paint codes for Lotus Yellow. Nothing came up on the computer. The original paint was a lacquer based paint which isn't available anymore. Do you know what brand was used and the code?

Did you try looking at the "Factory Paint Codes" on the home screen forum list? (third from bottom)
It redirects you here...http://www.lotus-europa.com/colors.html
You can click on the red ICI paints & Glasurit links...
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,November 26, 2016, 09:52:42 AM
A few more preview shots.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: 4129R on Saturday,November 26, 2016, 10:06:24 AM
Very unusual colour scheme for a Europa, but very close to an Elan Sprint, which was a very pretty car.

I am always surprised at how small these cars are compared to modern sports cars.

An Elan looks quite a bit smaller that the Mazda copy.

Alex in Norfolk.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Saturday,November 26, 2016, 11:18:36 AM
Very nicely done!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Certified Lotus on Saturday,November 26, 2016, 01:38:05 PM
I went to a professional paint shop here in the states and gave them all the various paint codes for Lotus Yellow. Nothing came up on the computer. The original paint was a lacquer based paint which isn't available anymore. Do you know what brand was used and the code?

Did you try looking at the "Factory Paint Codes" on the home screen forum list? (third from bottom)
It redirects you here...http://www.lotus-europa.com/colors.html
You can click on the red ICI paints & Glasurit links...

Yes, I did that. ICI owns Sikkens and I went to a Sikkens paint dealer and showed him the page of paint color. He said nothing in the computer to match it. He also mentioned that no one makes lacquer paint anymore so that is why the codes don't work.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: 3929R on Saturday,November 26, 2016, 06:10:01 PM
From the glimpses it looks amazing.
I kind of like the slow unveil, but is she waiting for the wedding night before she'll been seen wearing only a smile?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,November 27, 2016, 12:14:23 PM
A few more
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Sunday,November 27, 2016, 10:59:49 PM
Looking good....    I've never seen that Else-Europa badge before, did they all come with one ?  It's a great period addition.

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,November 28, 2016, 12:16:45 AM
Apparently so. I managed to get a photo of an original one and had that specially made.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,November 28, 2016, 02:18:44 PM
Crash pad re trimmed.  New headlining and dashboard trimmed.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,December 11, 2016, 06:38:16 AM
Headlining fitted
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,December 11, 2016, 06:40:24 AM
Dashboard redesigned crash pad trimmed and all ready to refit
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Sunday,December 11, 2016, 08:17:22 AM
The crash pad is very nice, is that a vinyl trim of the original foam filled one or a fibreglass replica ?  Whatever, it looks great.

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: TCS4605R on Sunday,December 11, 2016, 08:52:56 AM
Where did you purchase the crash pad or is it the original refinished?

Tom
TCS4605R
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Sunday,December 11, 2016, 09:15:55 AM
Very nicely done  modern version of the dash! I can't wait for pictures of it all together!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,December 11, 2016, 09:47:36 AM
It's just the original one retrimmed with dark grey vinyl.  There are so many new parts on this car I have tried to upcycle as much as possible so there are some original parts. 
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Certified Lotus on Monday,December 12, 2016, 01:49:52 AM
Very nice work! I'm impressed!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: buzzer on Monday,December 12, 2016, 03:12:56 AM
yes looking good, where did you get that headlining material?

dave
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Monday,December 12, 2016, 08:43:14 AM
 :happy-bday:
It's just the original one retrimmed with dark grey vinyl.  There are so many new parts on this car I have tried to upcycle as much as possible so there are some original parts.

I'm very impressed, it looks a professional job. Was it a kit or have you been borrowing the wife's sewing machine ?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,December 14, 2016, 11:11:46 AM
I trimmed the dashboard in black leather cloth as that was very easy but the crash pad was done by my local auto trimmer in dark grey and finished it with a lovely line of stitching Along the front.  The same retrimmer made the headlining for me from two layers of padded headlining fabric and stitched into a diamond pattern. They also made A pillar panels for me and another for the rear windscreen.  Al for £180 cash.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: EuropaTC on Wednesday,December 14, 2016, 01:15:46 PM
Well, the guy did an excellent job.

I've got one of Bank's centre consoles which is vinyl trimmed with neat stitching and I think it really makes a difference, it just lifts the interior. And the dash top is something you see all the time you're in the car, so it's money well spent IMO.

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,December 17, 2016, 11:25:27 AM
I've got one of those too, looking forward to fitting it in the new year.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,December 17, 2016, 11:29:16 AM
You may remember that my car is one owner from new until his death last year.  So in memory of Dr Fairfax I had these decal made.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Saturday,December 17, 2016, 11:46:24 AM
Nice touch!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,December 19, 2016, 12:31:52 PM
Fitted the crash pad this weekend and test fitted the redesigned dashboard. Still a lot to do but once it's been tweaked I think this going to look great.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Monday,December 19, 2016, 01:07:35 PM
Looks great but you swapped the positions of the glove box and steering wheel!  :FUNNY:
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: 3929R on Wednesday,December 21, 2016, 01:40:36 PM
Nice touch with the commemorative decal.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: StrawberryCheesecake on Sunday,January 01, 2017, 08:38:42 AM
Looks great. The paint came out really well, by the look of the pics.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,January 02, 2017, 09:47:56 AM
Realised recently how easy it is to complete jobs in the wrong order and then have to undo a job to fix something I overlooked.  So I've written a plan.  I was bored this weekend so I've already made a good start. 
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: BDA on Monday,January 02, 2017, 09:54:52 AM
 Plans are good. May I recommend keeping a notebook? It's something I started late in my build and I wish I had started sooner. If you do that, don't abbreviate or shortcut your notes as you'll want to be able to make sense of them down the road.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,January 02, 2017, 12:28:55 PM
Closed cell neoprene makes great sound proofing and is so easy to use
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,January 08, 2017, 06:15:26 AM
Shallow smoked indicators
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,February 03, 2017, 02:31:14 PM
A few updates
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: BDA on Friday,February 03, 2017, 03:10:00 PM
That looks great! Thanks also for the picture of your charging station.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,February 05, 2017, 09:00:24 AM
Cracked on with the interior this weekend. 
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: BDA on Tuesday,February 07, 2017, 02:45:59 PM
Nice! You're getting close!


 :lotus:
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: StrawberryCheesecake on Wednesday,February 08, 2017, 03:28:22 PM
Looking good! Have you got a target date to take it for an MOT?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,February 10, 2017, 03:14:37 PM
This is my 2017 schedule.  If all goes to plan she should be ready by May.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Certified Lotus on Friday,February 10, 2017, 03:42:39 PM
Wow! Am I impressed. And I thought I was organized.........
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: BDA on Friday,February 10, 2017, 06:05:43 PM
Woe! I'm impressed! And I know I'm not organized!  :)
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,February 18, 2017, 05:24:40 AM
With the sun out today I couldn't resist a preview photo shoot.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Bodzer on Saturday,February 18, 2017, 09:04:46 AM
Fantastic.  I can only hope to do half as good a job as you have done. Would you mind if I message you regarding my own Else? I don't want to hijack a superb thread.

All the best,

Pete
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: EuropaTC on Saturday,February 18, 2017, 09:05:53 AM
I can appreciate you're going for ultimate fuel economy, but don't you think towing it around on those little wheels is going to limit the top speed ?

 :)

Looks great. How long until you get it fired up and moving under it's own steam ?

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: BDA on Saturday,February 18, 2017, 01:50:03 PM
She's looking great! Hopefully it'll be making noise soon!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Bainford on Saturday,February 18, 2017, 03:24:39 PM
Beautiful!!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,February 19, 2017, 02:09:13 PM
The plan is still April. But there are still a few big hurdles
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,February 19, 2017, 02:11:31 PM
Bodzer. I'm very interested to hear about your Else project.  Please do pm me.  I'm only aware of 1 other in U.K.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,March 04, 2017, 08:32:49 AM
Having redisigned the basic wiring and introduced a multiple fuse box I held my breath today when I connected up the battery.  Despite nothing running for 37 years and all of the switches and instruments being re wired everything lit up today as planned and all of the instruments worked.  The biggest shock was the passenger electric window up and down. Only disappointed was drivers electric window down but not back up. 
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: BDA on Saturday,March 04, 2017, 09:06:31 AM
Congratulations on your wiring success! The window lift mechanism can sometimes jam. IIRC, you can "dial in" a bit of extra spring tension that helps that.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,March 19, 2017, 06:27:59 AM
I was genuinely dreading fitting the locks but it turned out easier than I had anticipated.  However as the window is currently stuck down I can't fit the handle.  Is it possible to manually lift the window?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: 4129R on Sunday,March 19, 2017, 06:36:51 AM
Only if the electric moving arm is disconnected from the bottom of the window.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,March 19, 2017, 10:14:20 AM
A couple of updates
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: BDA on Sunday,March 19, 2017, 10:18:23 AM
Very nice! I love the detailing!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Bainford on Tuesday,March 21, 2017, 08:10:05 AM
Fantastic work. Very tidy.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,April 21, 2017, 06:21:23 AM
Despite being on the home straight I have suffered a loss of enthusiasm recently and slowed down a bit.  However a day off yesterday perked me right up.  OS electric window motor cleaned and working again.  Door lock and handle fitted but OMG how hard and fiddly is that??  Started to re fit the steering column and discovered I don't have a steering wheel nut.  Amazed to discover that my local engineering works didn't have one and couldn't even identify the thread type.  Obviously Richard has them in stock so I can hopefully finish that bit this weekend.  MOT day has slipped now to June.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: jbcollier on Friday,April 21, 2017, 07:59:58 AM
Steering wheel nut is the same as every other 60s/70s Triumph on the road.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,May 06, 2017, 05:08:20 AM
Throughout this restoration I have had one nagging worry, my windscreen surround is hideous! It was some very very poor plastic coated aluminium trash that didn't meet in the corners and looked like it had been fitted by a 5 year old.  It was faded and looked awful.  When I took the car for re spray the screen guy wouldn't  remove the screen because he said it was almost impossible to take out without breaking.  And then there was Richard.  The aluminium corners he provided looked quite difficult to fit but were in fact a doddle.  I rubbed down the plastic surround and treated it with acetone to rough it up.  Masked and painted and OMG what a difference.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: BDA on Saturday,May 06, 2017, 06:17:21 AM
Richard is the man! That looks great!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,May 31, 2017, 06:32:17 AM
Really had to motivate myself in May, its bizarre that I have done so much in the last two years and now, the sun has arrived and I have so little left to do but I'm struggling to keep making progress.  Anyhow got into the garage this week a couple of times and fitted the heater fan, the coolant fan, wipers and washers. I even made up the front number plate last night and fitted that to help spur me on.  Only the fuel system to fit when I get back from my hols and hopefully we can start to commission her.

My first big target is the Silverstone classic  in July.     
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Certified Lotus on Wednesday,May 31, 2017, 02:54:45 PM
Your so close to finishing, keep the faith! I had the same situation in the rebuild of my Elan, the last month or two was always two steps forward, one step back. Having a target date to complete (it was also a car show for me) helps a lot.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Bodzer on Thursday,June 01, 2017, 02:03:11 AM
 Almost there! Good luck with the last few pieces. I'm expecting delivery of the new chassis in the next day or two, then I can start mine.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: buzzer on Thursday,June 01, 2017, 02:08:42 AM
Good luck with trying to get it ready for Silverstone classic in July, My Lotus won't make it  :( But my Range Rover CSK will  :) I'll be on the Range Rover stand. Hopefully see you there.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,June 01, 2017, 02:54:35 AM
Everything now working at the front end
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: BDA on Thursday,June 01, 2017, 06:50:09 AM
Very nicely done!


 :lotus:
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,June 22, 2017, 10:32:39 AM
Fitted the new VIN plate today and finished the plenum chamber.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: BDA on Thursday,June 22, 2017, 10:53:17 AM
Very clean! Well done!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Bainford on Friday,June 23, 2017, 10:46:31 AM
Yup, clean and tidy. Looking good.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,July 02, 2017, 03:05:22 AM
Rear lights now working and number plate fitted
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Bodzer on Sunday,July 02, 2017, 01:56:21 PM
Well done! Looking great.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,July 07, 2017, 11:38:55 AM
Home made A pillar trims fitted today
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,July 14, 2017, 03:40:39 AM
Remote alarm, Central locking and immobiliser fitted today.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: BDA on Friday,July 14, 2017, 06:25:33 AM
Very nice! When I was building my car, I bought a remote keyless entry kit but I never installed it because one of my locks was pretty stiff and I was afraid of burning out a motor. Do you have a feel for how strong those motors are? I still have the kit and it would be cool to not have to use my key to get in.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: SwiftDB4 on Friday,July 14, 2017, 08:37:06 AM
I'd be hesitant to rely on the motor if the lock itself is stiff. I installed remote motors on my GT40, but none of the mechanism was stiff. I removed the door handles on my Europa, but kept the key mechanism precisely because they are too stiff.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: BDA on Friday,July 14, 2017, 09:05:13 AM
I replaced the locks, but not the door handles when I built my car. Don't know why but the driver's door is very easy but the driver's door is stiffer. It is getting easier though so maybe I ought to just wait and see if it loosens up further.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,July 14, 2017, 01:00:31 PM
I gave everything a good goat of WD40 And eased all the linkages first.  The solenoids don't appear to have any difficulty at all. They both worked first time and just keep working so far.  Early on in the project I installed an earth isolator switch so I have had to run in a perm earth for the alarm and the central locking.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,July 15, 2017, 10:07:26 AM
Gutted today.  Working elsewhere on the car, heard a bang, looked up and saw this.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: BDA on Saturday,July 15, 2017, 10:48:53 AM
Oh, man! Sorry to see that! Hopefully you can get it made right quickly!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: EuropaTC on Saturday,July 15, 2017, 10:09:14 PM
ouch !  Was it a new glass or the original one ?  I would imagine there are plastic replacements from Richard but a glass one would be preferable. Does anyone know if new door glass is still being made ?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,July 16, 2017, 02:57:58 PM
Original glass. I'm ringing Richard in the morning.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,July 16, 2017, 02:59:34 PM
Speaker grills

My previous owner had replaced the original speaker grills with these awful 70s  Goodman speakers. Horrible and the originals had left a nasty imprint on the vinyl.  I didn't want to re trim the door cards but bigger speaker grills looked terrible. But then when I removed the Goodmans I discovered that the originals grills where behind the door card.  Unfortunately he had drilled 4 holes in the grills and they were a bit rusty.  So I removed the mesh from the frame, sandblasted and painted them and trimmed them in some genuine original Marshall Amplification fabric.  Very happy with the final job.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: BDA on Sunday,July 16, 2017, 05:09:15 PM
I agree. It looks very nice!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Tuesday,July 25, 2017, 01:22:50 PM
I was really surprised how difficult it is to fit the door cards firmly  Even with new clips.  One of the most important bits of kit I bought last year was a nut rivet gun and on this project it has proved invaluable for jobs like this. 
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,July 26, 2017, 02:13:08 PM
Another little upgrade to try and protect the sills.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: BDA on Wednesday,July 26, 2017, 02:14:18 PM
Very classy!



  :lotus:
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: 4129R on Wednesday,July 26, 2017, 09:51:32 PM
I was really surprised how difficult it is to fit the door cards firmly  Even with new clips.  One of the most important bits of kit I bought last year was a nut rivet gun and on this project it has proved invaluable for jobs like this.

I'm having the same problem with my door cards, and I came to the same conclusion about Rivnuts. My only concern is the Rivnuts may be for smaller thickness metal, so might not compress well against the thicker fibreglass.

My next problem is with new door rubbers, the doors do not shut with a watertight fit. I have large gaps showing daylight.

Alex in Norfolk.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: EuropaTC on Wednesday,July 26, 2017, 10:42:46 PM
the doors do not shut with a watertight fit. I have large gaps showing daylight.
Alex in Norfolk.

That's not a gap, it's called "air conditioning"    :)

Being serious, the actual door cards haven't been a serious issue on my car.

When I bought it the previous owner had fitted a screw at the top/rear of the panel, just as others have done which stops the horizontal section from slipping out of the aluminium window frame trim but the rest relied on the normal clips. When I fitted radio speakers in the doors I let the mounting screws bite into the door itself rather than mount the speaker on the trim panel alone and that will secure the front end of the trim panel without looking non-original.   

The door seals have been a long term problem, I guess I was just lucky when I replaced mine. Whether the replacements are a slightly larger moulding or stiffer rubber than the originals I don't know, but folks have had trouble in that department going back to the 1980s at least.   I've no idea what the solution is but if I had to replace mine I think I'd look around at what alternative mouldings there are these days and try for something with a bit more flexibility - something like ETS60 towards the bottom of this page  maybe ?

http://www.sealsdirect.co.uk/shopping.asp?intDepartmentId=71#23 (http://www.sealsdirect.co.uk/shopping.asp?intDepartmentId=71#23)

I know of people using that pattern on the Elan and IIRC it's similar to the seal used on the later sprints. (not sure on that one)

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,July 27, 2017, 04:59:35 AM
I fitted my new door seals a few weeks ago and the doors are nowhere even close to shutting properly.  That is a great web site, they have some fab stuff.  I have requested several samples, they certainly seem to have a much smaller seal that might be a better fit ETS3239
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: BDA on Thursday,July 27, 2017, 05:30:16 AM
Quote
I'm having the same problem with my door cards, and I came to the same conclusion about Rivnuts. My only concern is the Rivnuts may be for smaller thickness metal, so might not compress well against the thicker fibreglass.


I used (fake) Rivnuts in fiberglass several places with good success. I think if you drill the proper size hole and are careful when screwing and unscrewing, you should be fine.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: buzzer on Thursday,July 27, 2017, 06:40:26 AM
Rivnuts are great, I presume you are using ally one's. You can get rivets with serrated shafts that will help grip the fibreglass ok
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,September 07, 2017, 04:46:36 PM
Working late tonight But delighted to say that my Europa restoration is largely finished tonight after 26 months.  She's going off to my local garage to complete some technical snagging issues then tuning and MOT. Hopefully ready for  shake down and running in by the end of the month.  Thanks to my buddy Martyn who has helped and supported and kept me sane for the last two years.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: BDA on Thursday,September 07, 2017, 05:22:45 PM
She sure is a beauty! Congratulations!!!  :beerchug:
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Midnight on Friday,September 08, 2017, 05:07:41 AM
Absolutely gorgeous, I love the paint scheme, stunning job. I'm about to start my own project, be interesting to find out any lessons learned.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,September 08, 2017, 06:52:11 AM
Thanks for your comments.

Midnight, I have detailed every problem and every step throughout these 23 pages, I hope you enjoy your project and have a high limit on your credit card!!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,October 11, 2017, 03:46:10 AM
Gotta say this project is starting to wear me down.  Finally got the engine running a little more smoothly today for the first time. But despite replacing the sump gasket (again) last week I still have a large pool of oil under the car. It looks like the timing chain case gasket is leaking but it's hard to tell. 1 step forward and 2 steps back.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: jbcollier on Wednesday,October 11, 2017, 06:00:36 AM
The most common oil leak on the Renault engine is the valve cover.  It then flows down so it looks like it's leaking from elsewhere.  I go around the valve cover with a thin feeler gauge to make sure it is tight all the way round.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: EuropaTC on Wednesday,October 11, 2017, 09:00:44 AM
Gotta say this project is starting to wear me down.
You're too close to the job.  Stand back and look at what you've achieved; you've taken an old Airfix kit of parts and made a cracking car out of it, it's no wonder it gets you down if the finish line seems to be edging away from you.

We all get like that at times, it wouldn't be the first time I've closed the garage door muttering "sod this for a game of soldiers..." (or similar, Russian sounding expressions ;)  ). So cut yourself some slack, you've done great to get where you are now.   Heck, what's the odd leak ? you get a gallon in a can of oil, it'll last for ages  :)
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: 4129R on Wednesday,October 11, 2017, 09:52:45 AM
Gotta say this project is starting to wear me down.  Finally got the engine running a little more smoothly today for the first time. But despite replacing the sump gasket (again) last week I still have a large pool of oil under the car. It looks like the timing chain case gasket is leaking but it's hard to tell. 1 step forward and 2 steps back.

You have definitely got to be in the right mood to deal with problems on the car.

If you are not in the right mood, you will only make things worse.

Take a "chill pill" and wait until you are in the right mood, with the right weather. No rush. Then you can think clearly and find the problem easily.

I find 10 minutes think time can save 2 hours of doing it all wrong and having to do it again.

Alex in Norfolk (now working on #4, 4129R)
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: BDA on Wednesday,October 11, 2017, 10:59:32 AM
Gotta say this project is starting to wear me down.  Finally got the engine running a little more smoothly today for the first time. But despite replacing the sump gasket (again) last week I still have a large pool of oil under the car. It looks like the timing chain case gasket is leaking but it's hard to tell. 1 step forward and 2 steps back.
I know exactly what you're going through. I was trying to get my car presentable (not drivable) for a meet the US Lotus club was putting on. IIRC, it coincided with the 50th anniversary of Lotus and it was reasonably close by for a change so I was really motivated to get it ready.


I was working on the electrics and had "graduated" from using a dry cell battery that I used to check continuity to a car battery. I was carefully working on the wiring behind the dash when I turned around for some reason. The next thing that happened was I heard a "tick" of a light metal to metal contact. I turned back around to see smoke billowing from behind my dash! I disconnected the battery as soon as I could and went inside to contemplate suicide. I was devastated! I knew all the dash wiring was a cinder.


After about ten minutes, I gathered myself together enough to view the damage. There actually very little! What had happened is the stainless steel braided hose I used for the oil pressure gauge had flopped over and shorted on something. Most of the smoke that I saw came from the rubber hose of that oil pressure gauge line burning. All I had to do was make a new hose and replace a couple of short wires.


Alex and Brian are right. Step back, relax, and regroup. The last two percent is always the hardest. You car is beautiful. You'll straighten this out and what you're feeling now will soon be a distant memory.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,October 12, 2017, 05:36:15 AM
Thanks everyone for your motivation and support.  I'll take a few days out of the garage and have another look next week. 

There is spattered oil on the bulkhead behind the head so I'm a bit worried that the rubber seal at the back of the head is leaking, that would be very bad news given that I have replaced the head gasket and resealed the rear rubber gasket a long time ago.  I'm guessing that if I remove the rear timing chain cover i could re seal the rubber at the top without removing the head?   
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: jbcollier on Thursday,October 12, 2017, 06:55:03 AM
The timing cover is below the head so no need to remove it.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: buzzer on Friday,October 13, 2017, 01:50:55 AM
Definitely concur with the "be in the right mood for it" approach!! The time I break things is when I don't stop and and walk away and the time I fix things is after I have had time to think about the problem !

Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Certified Lotus on Friday,October 13, 2017, 03:01:25 AM
I’m on my third complete restoration project in 3years. Keep the faith and think about all you have accomplished. Stand back and look at how close you are to finishing every time you get frustrated. And most importantly, have a beer and relax when you have had enough for the day.

My friend Drew was helping me rebuild the transmission of a 64 Elan (close ratio). We had it all reassembled with new bearings and couldn’t get it into 4th gear. Took it completely apart and reassembled again (same day). Still wouldn’t go into 4th gear. Very frustrating. I said stop and get a couple of beers (it was a hot & humid July afternoon). While enjoying the ice cold beer and the stress dissolving (I had two beers) I looked at the gear box a different way and realized the bell housing would push one of the selector shafts in about 1/8th an inch. We bolted up the bell housing and everything worked perfectly. I now always have a fridge stocked with cold beer. You have no idea how many problems I have solved  :o
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Bodzer on Sunday,October 15, 2017, 01:25:55 PM
Well done Gary. It’s looking great. Mine is just about to re-mated to the chassis. Some way to go yet!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,October 22, 2017, 11:55:33 AM
Delighted yesterday that the timing chain cover was surprisingly easy to remove. I bought an endoscope camera off eBay for £20 that connects to an iPad. I was able to see the leake with the engine running and it was clearly leaking from the rubber seal at the top. So fresh rubber seal, gaskets and some sealant and hopefully I can get this running by next weekend without quite some much oil gushing out.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: EuropaTC on Sunday,October 22, 2017, 11:02:03 PM
Well that's good news, at least you know where you're going with it now and a new gasket plus a bit of patience will sort that one out. On the endoscope, it's amazing what technology you can get these days for very little money. Back in the 80s I remember chatting with our inspection engineer about the possibility of buying "one of these fibre optic things" and finding it was well out of the works annual inspection budget !

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,November 19, 2017, 05:17:16 AM
After sealing the timing chain cover and tightening the sump I discovered a damaged thread on the bottom of the timing chain cover and consequently couldn't  tighten the sump.  Having sealed it all up I was loathed to dismantle it all again. So I took a short break, for my mental health. Then I purchased a new  M8 tap with extra long ratchet tool and re threaded the cover in situ. The bolt tightened up nicely yesterday and I got the engine running  without checking out oil everywhere. Hoping to send her off for tuning next week.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: EuropaTC on Sunday,November 19, 2017, 09:05:24 AM
So I took a short break, for my mental health.

 :)  been there, done that !  It really is the best policy to simply walk away for a while. It's different if you're doing these things for a living, but a hobby should always be fun; get you thinking, yes, raise your blood pressure...  no !

It sounds like you're almost there, have you MoT'd it yet or is that joy still to come ?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: lotusfanatic on Sunday,November 19, 2017, 11:59:20 PM
it’s surprising how a ‘big’ issue can be thought through once you take a step back...
I’m glad to hear that it all went well
😊
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,November 23, 2017, 03:36:57 PM
She went off to a specialist tuner this week.  Hopefully next week she’s going straight to an MOT Garage. And then I can finish the last bits of trim and she’s ready for spring.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,November 30, 2017, 12:55:45 PM
Tuning specialist rang me today. He found so many faults, he said it was a miracle I ever got her running.  A little disappointed that he found 4 faults in the fully reconditioned Weber carb and two faults in the fully reconditioned distributor. Jobs which I paid others to do.  Anyhow she’s running beautifully and is ready to be collected tomorrow and is then going to a local Garage for a couple of jobs and hopefully MOT.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: EuropaTC on Thursday,November 30, 2017, 11:14:33 PM
Hmm, it's disappointing to hear things like that, especially when you had decided to give the job to a specialist with more knowledge/experience. But it might just have been minor faults like adjustment and hopefully all that will be sorted by now.

Looking forward to the MoT result, with a car as clean as that I think you might just scrape a pass.....   ;)

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Bodzer on Friday,December 01, 2017, 07:25:42 AM
 Well Done. Good luck with the MoT. I’ve just taken the last few bits off the body so I can start prepping that. A long way to go yet!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2017
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,January 27, 2018, 08:58:57 AM
Well after months of frustration, those who have followed another thread will understand this, I’ve finally got the brakes bled through and working beautifully. On the Home straight now. 1 piece of glass, and some trim and I’m good to go for MOT. oh and btw you may be interested to learn that a front splitter off a Seat Cupra R looks superb on a Europa. Photos to follow.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,January 28, 2018, 02:42:50 PM
Some may notice that when I started this project I called it Else Europa restoration 2015. I changed that the following year to 2015-2016. After much frustration I changed it again to 2015-2017. Just had to change it again, hope that’s the last time
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Certified Lotus on Sunday,January 28, 2018, 02:54:03 PM
Trust me, after several Lotus restorations (in my garage) it will all be worth it  :trophy:
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,February 03, 2018, 01:49:18 PM
A couple of recent upgrades to mention. Redesigned front spoiler using a Seat Cupra R splitter
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,February 03, 2018, 01:55:23 PM
Once I had fitted Electronic ignition the rev counter stopped working so this RVI to RVC conversion was required.  Anyone planning to do this, don’t forget that you need to change the basic wiring otherwise the car won’t start, duh that took me far too long to figure out.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Certified Lotus on Saturday,February 03, 2018, 02:26:17 PM
Front spoiler looks like it was made for the car. Nice work!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: surfguitar58 on Sunday,February 04, 2018, 03:14:37 AM
Once I had fitted Electronic ignition the rev counter stopped working so this RVI to RVC conversion was required.  Anyone planning to do this, don’t forget that you need to change the basic wiring otherwise the car won’t start, duh that took me far too long to figure out.

Very timely post Gmg31, I am getting ready to install a pertronix electronic dizzy and coil on the TCS. I thought the Smiths +/- earth kit was just for bass ackward pos earth MGs. Does the coil lead loop not work with electronic ignition?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: BDA on Sunday,February 04, 2018, 06:03:24 AM
You may want to wait to see if your Pertronix and tach get along. I know it seems the usual deal is that the tach has a problem with the Pertronix but I had the opposite experience.

When I got my motor from Dave Bean many years ago, he had installed an optical ignition, I believe from Allison. I had pretty bad tach bounce above 3000 rpm or so. It gave out while I was in the left lane on the Interstate! I replaced it and the coil with Pertronix units and my tach calmed down.

I have no explanation but this does occur to me. Before I installed the gauges, I sent them to Nisonger to check them out. I didn't ask for anything than that but it's possible they do some upgrade on the tach as part of their checking it out but I don't remember any mention of it so I'd be surprised if they did.

Your supposed to use resistance plug wires with Pertronix. I got mine from Pertronix to make sure I got the right ones.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,February 08, 2018, 02:00:21 PM
So when you upgrade the rev counter you need to join the two white wires so that the ignition live goes straight from the barrel to the coil. You then need to add a new wire from one of the bullet connectors to the coil. It depends which type of coil you use as to which bullet connector to use.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: EuropaTC on Thursday,February 08, 2018, 10:13:42 PM
Every day a school day....   that's a new one on me, I didn't appreciate there were different inputs for standard and sports coils. Is that the Spyda (?) conversion kit or something else ?

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: surfguitar58 on Friday,February 09, 2018, 04:26:47 AM
I'm guessing a Pertronix "Flamethrower" .6 Ohm low resistance Ignitor II coil be considered a "sport" coil?

I was unaware of Nisonger until I read BDA's post (Thanks BDA!) They have a kit for "Smith's Electric Tach Conversions" where they state: "...Smiths & British Jaeger RV Series "Loop Tachs"... ...are not truly compatible with any electronic ignition systems." http://www.nisonger.com/electric-tachometer-conversions.htm

Not TRULY compatible? I hate ambiguity. How hard is it to extract the tach from the dashboard? Does the whole dashboard have to come out?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: jbcollier on Friday,February 09, 2018, 05:40:46 AM
The standard Pertronix unit requires a coil to have a primary circuit resistance of at least 3 ohms.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: BDA on Friday,February 09, 2018, 05:48:38 AM
You're welcome, Surf!  :)

The tach, as well as all the other gauges come out pretty easily (considering the access to the rear of the gauge). They are all held in the same way. There is a stud that comes out of the rear of the gauge. A bracket goes over the stud and held on with a thumb screw that pushes the bracket against the dash holding the gauge in. In the case of the larger gauges, there are two clamps and thumb screws. Serge's video on restoring his gauges should help you understand better than my description (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UyBWbNYvxhg).
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: surfguitar58 on Friday,February 09, 2018, 07:10:29 AM
The standard Pertronix unit requires a coil to have a primary circuit resistance of at least 3 ohms.

JB: Apparently the "Ignitor II" (which is what I have) is compatible with low resistance ignition coils.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: jbcollier on Friday,February 09, 2018, 02:35:47 PM
Just wanted to make sure.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,February 10, 2018, 03:06:49 PM
Today was fun.  I had some Do Not Jack stickers made and stuck them to the underside to try and protect my floor from garage idiots. I then greased all the joints on the gear linkage and for the first time in 39 years I sent power to the rear wheels obviously she was up on axle stands for now but after a great deal of effort I eventually managed 2nd 3rd 4th and occasionally 1st but that is a real struggle.  I’m hoping it will all loosen off after much more use.  I’m hoping to try and propel her along tarmac next weekend.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: BDA on Saturday,February 10, 2018, 05:37:54 PM
Great news! The obvious question is if you have the proper amount and type of oil in your tranny. Keep us informed about your shifting.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Certified Lotus on Sunday,February 11, 2018, 03:42:29 AM
An engine that has sat that long is going to have issues. Seals will dry out and the cylinder walls will have an imprint where the rings have sat for a long time. There is probably surface rust on the cylinder walls. At a minimum I would spray Marvel Mystery oil down each cylinder and turn the crank as many times as you can. Then let it sit and do it again a week later.

I would replace the water pump with a rebuild kit and the crank shaft seals. And if it were my engine i’d Pull the head to inspect each cylinder as you might have to hone them and replace the rings.

The carb(s) may need rebuilding, just for the paper gaskets.

Good luck!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,February 11, 2018, 02:07:27 PM
I think you may have missed pages 2-24.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Certified Lotus on Sunday,February 11, 2018, 04:27:25 PM
Sorry, I thought you acquired another car?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Tuesday,February 13, 2018, 01:42:21 AM
Sorry, I thought you acquired another car?

I think that's the least likely thing that's going to happen to me this year. 
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,February 25, 2018, 04:06:56 AM
Test drive last weekend was problematic but once I sorted the brakes out I had another trip out yesterday. Still struggling with gears but I could easily get 2nd 4th and Rev so I was able to have a short  and quite exiliarting spin round the block. Going to my local garage this week to sort out the linkage and hopefully for MOT. Latest photos in the sun have come out well.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: EuropaTC on Sunday,February 25, 2018, 09:29:54 AM
 :pirate:

Driving around is real progress....   and the sun is shining over here as well !  (but it's still cold down here)

If your garage has facilities it might be worth getting them to check front & rear alignments whilst they're doing the MoT. That's not casting aspersions on your rebuild, I normally do my own alignments but have had my local garage check and confirm for me at MoT time. Toe out at the rear is going to spoil your enjoyment of the car and the reassurance of a check is well worth it, even if they say "it's good" I don't begrudge the cost.

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: surfguitar58 on Sunday,February 25, 2018, 10:00:46 AM
 :beerchug:
Congrats Gmg31! She looks fantastic! A real piece of history there. Do you know of any other restored Else Europas in existence? How many were made/converted? (Apologies if that info is buried in the thread somewhere and I missed it.)
Tom
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: BDA on Sunday,February 25, 2018, 10:41:49 AM
Congratulations on your maiden drive!  :beerchug:

Here's hoping you get your shift problem straightened out soon!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: surfguitar58 on Sunday,February 25, 2018, 05:01:20 PM
1st gear is over rated anyway. ;D
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Bainford on Tuesday,February 27, 2018, 11:27:34 AM
The car looks great. Congrats on the short test drive. Hears hoping you get the shift issues sorted, and I second Brian's suggestion to have the alignment verified. Hope you get properly road ready soon. Cheers.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,March 01, 2018, 06:13:26 AM
Thanks guys, yes tracking is on the list. As far as I’m aware there is only one other restored Else Europa that is Steve Jarvis who is in the forum and then there is one being restored in Ireland by Peter who is also in the group.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: dakazman on Thursday,March 01, 2018, 07:58:50 AM
 :trophy:
Beautiful job , well done.

Dakazman
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Thursday,March 01, 2018, 09:04:17 AM
A couple of interior shots.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: dakazman on Thursday,March 01, 2018, 09:11:45 AM
Ok , you got me with the yellow gloves😋 . The DETAILS make it yours, again nicely done
Dakazman
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: EuropaTC on Thursday,March 01, 2018, 09:53:49 AM
What's that on the sills, is it a vinyl covering or printed aluminium ? It looks good and sets off the "entrance" very well.

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: BDA on Thursday,March 01, 2018, 10:21:05 AM
Pretty! You need an ashtray, though. Certified Lotus might be able to help you!  :)
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Certified Lotus on Thursday,March 01, 2018, 12:41:52 PM
Impressive! Very nice work. Yes, I do have a “spare”ash tray but they are stupid expensive.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: BDA on Thursday,March 01, 2018, 12:49:27 PM
Actually, I had forgotten you had a spare, I was thinking he could hire you to find one for him since you obviously have a talent for it!  :))
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,March 03, 2018, 12:16:50 AM
Had a bit of an argument with the MOT centre who failed her on the number plates. He insists she has to have reflective number plates and refused to read the official Gov guidance on pre 73 cars. So I’ve had to spend money on temp plates to pass and then take them off.   No more. MOT after May so shouldnt have that problem again.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,March 03, 2018, 12:21:05 AM
What's that on the sills, is it a vinyl covering or printed aluminium ? It looks good and sets off the "entrance" very well.

Brian

They are a vinyl decal made by “ I say ding dong” what you can’t see is the sill has a simple white carbon fibre sill cover to protect the paint which is edged with gold and then has the Lotus decal.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,March 03, 2018, 09:31:47 AM
Finally passed MOT today. Still quite a lot of work to do but I can start getting her ready for the summer. Delighted to finally fit the luggage compartment which I had trimmed almost two years ago.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: EuropaTC on Saturday,March 03, 2018, 09:36:39 AM
Failed on number plates ? Clearly you have an MoT tester who doesn't know very much and as you say, pre '73 the rules are entirely different.   Where I go for my MoTs they are both understanding about the quirks of older cars and also very willing to chat about what they look for, etc. 

I'd be tempted to make an official complaint because the response you've had isn't being thorough or over cautious, it just indicates someone who hasn't bothered to read the rules about what he's testing. That is a bad mark for the profession and should be cleared up.

On the sill covers, they look very good, that decal looks great.  I just have plain black vinyl on mine and something like that would really brighten it up. I've used "ding dong" myself for period stickers, they have done good work before so I think I might drop them an email. Thanks for the info.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: BDA on Saturday,March 03, 2018, 09:54:34 AM
Congrats on your MOT!!  :beerchug:

She's really stunning! You've really done yourself proud!

Good luck on your shake out!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: dakazman on Saturday,March 03, 2018, 04:33:13 PM
 GMG31,
Nice engine compartment and mirror finish on the cover and firewall.
Again, nice job and bye how does it feel to turn heads ??? Lol.
Dakazman
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: buzzer on Sunday,March 04, 2018, 03:27:14 AM
Great news on the MOT. I’m getting close now to getting mine MOTD be interesting if I get the number plate issue. I use a local regular guy for all my cars so we shall see. Interesting on mine as it’s early 73 and originally had black numbers on the grill, so we shall see. So when it was new it didn’t meet the UK regs 😱.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Certified Lotus on Sunday,March 04, 2018, 03:43:23 AM
Absolutely spectacular restoration job! Congratulations.  :trophy: :trophy: :trophy:

It’s a major accomplishment to restore a car in your home garage and take the time to learn about aspects of mechanical systems you never knew or understood.

The first month or two of being on the road is always full of little adjustments and rethinking about doing something differently. But after that you just jump in the car to go for a ride.

By the way, did you ever move to the new house with the massive garage?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: buzzer on Sunday,March 04, 2018, 03:54:11 AM
What reflective film did you use on the inside of the lid and the bulkhead
. Looks fantastic .
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Bainford on Monday,March 05, 2018, 08:19:30 AM
Congrats on the MOT. That is definitely a job to be proud of. The under hood work is very tidy. Outstanding sir. You have done well. :beerchug:
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,March 05, 2018, 02:39:15 PM
What reflective film did you use on the inside of the lid and the bulkhead
. Looks fantastic .

I googled gold self adhesive heat shield. But that was a long time ago and I’m afraid I can’t remember where I got it. It was surprisingly expensive though and I had to think about it for a while.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,March 05, 2018, 02:59:16 PM


By the way, did you ever move to the new house with the massive garage?

Sadly not,  the owner had an aneurism and took the house off the market. He promised me first refusal if he ever re lists it though.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: gideon on Monday,March 05, 2018, 03:13:04 PM
Gold heat shield - http://designengineering.com/heat-screen-gold/
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Bodzer on Monday,March 05, 2018, 11:50:57 PM
Great news! Looking good for the summer.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,April 02, 2018, 07:51:34 AM
Finished the suspension upgrades this weekend after some frustrating issues with ride heights. Terrible weather since I MOTd her so  I’ve still never managed to take her out for a drive yet. 
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,June 18, 2018, 06:54:18 AM
I've done 1200 miles since "finishing the project" and there are some issues that need to be resolved.  Despite all new oil seals the gear box is still leaking.  I'm going to wait until winter and either upgrade to a 5 speed or just renew the seals (again).  I still have problems with third gear and really struggle to get it going up the gears, much easier going down.

I did a lot of shopping around when I bought my carpets and I'm so disappointed.  I'm ripping them out in two weeks and taking the car to an auto trimmer to make custom carpets.  Some key things that are essential.  Where the carpets meet the door seals they need to have vinyl or leather on the edge so you can rap it over the seam and lock it down with the seal.  The floor area in front of the seats needs to be sturdy or fixed down otherwise every time you get out you twist the carpet and it bunches up.  This is not an area for saving money and I deeply regret getting a carpet set.

The car runs really well but she pinks very badly between 2-3k revs.  Above 3k she just wants to fly and I have to keep a steady hold on the speed.

Really surprised how economical she is.  I'm tracking every mile on a spread sheet and the first two tanks of fuel she returned 37 mpg.  To be fare I was taking it easy as I was gently running her in and the brakes were terrible.  Since them I've added a Servo and I drive her a little quicker and she is still doing 32 mpg.

Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: EuropaTC on Monday,June 18, 2018, 09:09:39 AM
1200 miles is good, that's more than I normally do although I'll admit I only ever use my old cars when the sun's shining...   which is sometimes "challenging" in the UK  ;)

I wonder if your gearbox problems are shift-related ?  With my shift mechanism there's not very much you can do apart from the middle joint dimensions but I wonder if there's any tweaking you can do with the arm lengths on yours ?  It just sounds odd if there's no untoward grumbling from the box and it shifts down ok, it makes me wonder if the linkage isn't quite spot on.

But even so, I'd say you're doing quite well with such a small "snag sheet".

Brian
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: buzzer on Tuesday,June 19, 2018, 03:23:24 AM
Good going on getting some miles on it. on going to a 5 speed to fix the leaks I would not be sure that would fix the leaks. you will be swapping one leak for another. I am having problems with leaks on my 5 speed. on fitting carpets on the sill carpet I glued in place and tried to the edge of the door seal and that worked well. On the floor carpet I intend to use some 2 inch velcro strips to hold the carpet in place and see if that works.
On shifting what oil are you using the right oil. I am using a GL4 good quality mineral and that helps and the change up 2nd to 3rd I find the trickiest too. I would agree linkage is potentially the main culprit.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: GavinT on Tuesday,June 19, 2018, 03:39:29 AM
On the carpet issue, my Type 54 had carpet press studs in the floor.
I recall there were probably two on each side of the backbone, but the actual number may be wrong.
Anyone else have these?

Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Lou Drozdowski on Tuesday,June 19, 2018, 03:54:01 AM
R & D has a carpet set fasteners...$14.95
Cheers!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: jbcollier on Tuesday,June 19, 2018, 08:31:57 AM
Any of the British parts suppliers will have them.  Probably your local auto/marine upholstery shop as well.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Tuesday,July 17, 2018, 03:37:51 PM
Took my car to my trusted autotrimmer last week. And he worked Miracles.  I had several issues that I just didn’t have the skills to correct. When I fitted the roof lining there was no way of joining it to the top of the screen in a neat way. Similarly the A pillar and the edge of the lining above the doors were just not good enough.  I went for the best carpet on the market and my trimmer has edged every piece with leather.  I also bought a cheap drinks holder from eBay and he trimmed it all to match and fitted it to the bulkhead. Very very happy with result.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Tuesday,July 17, 2018, 03:40:05 PM
Some more
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: dakazman on Tuesday,July 17, 2018, 05:03:11 PM
The carpet, headliner look great.
Dakazman
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: BDA on Tuesday,July 17, 2018, 08:16:34 PM
That looks spectacular! That is very nicely done! She really is a beauty inside and out! Congratulations!

 :lotus:
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Clifton on Wednesday,July 18, 2018, 01:36:10 PM
Your head liner is beautiful. I am now ashamed of mine and will redo before reinstalling my windshield.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Bainford on Thursday,July 19, 2018, 09:01:21 AM
Looking great. Very tidy work. That will spruce up the office nicely.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Certified Lotus on Monday,July 23, 2018, 03:42:26 AM
Impressive work! I was going to leave my headliner stock but you have given me some ideas.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Yellowbelly on Monday,July 23, 2018, 06:39:57 AM
Having followed your threads over the last few months it was good to see the car in the flesh at Silverstone and i can confirm that it looks even better than the pictures show.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Wednesday,July 25, 2018, 02:07:02 PM
Good to meet you Paul. I look forward to seeing your project, especially your plan for AC we were sweltering on the way home on Sunday!!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Friday,March 01, 2019, 02:43:40 PM
A fantastic first year 3600 miles and surprisingly few issues.  As the season drew to a close I was only able to get 2nd and 4th gears and gear box oil leaks were deteriorating.  So after a brief rest I got back into the workshop this week.  Gearbox out, new seals and a fresh coat of paint.  New gear linkage and lever from Banks.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: andy harwood on Friday,March 01, 2019, 07:31:46 PM
The new bits look great!
Is the new shift lever a press fit in the spherical bearing? or, is there means to secure? Just curious.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: LotusJoe on Friday,March 01, 2019, 07:35:57 PM
The new bits look great!
Is the new shift lever a press fit in the spherical bearing? or, is there means to secure? Just curious.
Mine is secure with a circlip
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Bodzer on Friday,March 01, 2019, 11:30:41 PM
That sounds like you had a great first year. Well done. The restoration is a credit to you.
I’ve stripped the body on mine and am doing Fibreglass repairs now. Nearly there!
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Saturday,March 02, 2019, 01:50:18 AM
It’s a tight fit but yes it pushes all the way in to the shoulder and is then secured with a circlip
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Sunday,March 03, 2019, 05:05:52 AM
Gear box repainted and Oil seals replaced. Ready to refit next weekend.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: TCS4605R on Sunday,March 03, 2019, 05:25:30 PM
What did you paint the aluminum gearbox housing with?

Tom
74TCS - 4605R
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Gmg31 on Monday,August 03, 2020, 03:09:59 PM
Hi guys.  Well after 3 summers of almost trouble free motoring it’s time for this amazing car to move to a new home this week.  6000 miles has included 2 trips to the Silverstone classic weekend and the Lotus 70th Birthday trip to Hethel  where she was on the Club Stand.  She’s been in three editions of Club Lotus magazine and Absolute Lotus  magazine.  My only complaint has been the almost constant oil leak from the main oil seal in the gear box. I’ve changed it 3 times and the most recent fix has almost sorted it but still a tiny drip after each trip. I struggled with the gear linkage  the first year but once upgraded and a lot of adjustment I’ve since enjoyed all of the gears.  I have thoroughly enjoyed restoring and driving this car and I wish the new owner many years of joy. 

Keep you eyes open for my new project which I hope to start next week. 

Thanks for all your help. Gary
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: BDA on Monday,August 03, 2020, 03:21:56 PM
I'd keep her but if you're intent on selling, I hope you get a good price. She really is a beauty!

Let us know what your next project is.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Broadside on Friday,November 06, 2020, 12:44:14 PM
Well having just restarted my project I've been reading your thread with interest. I have with mine an Else inlet and exhaust manifold and am planning to use them, but what are the chances of getting an Else rocker cover?? very small I guess, but it really is the centre piece of your engine bay! The whole thing looks stuning. I'm guessing you sold it now?
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Richard48Y on Friday,November 06, 2020, 10:18:13 PM
Just read the entire thread at a single sitting.
Exceptional job even if I would never put cup holders into a sports car.

Baffles me how you could bear to part with it after so much work.
Title: Re: ELSE Europa restoration 2015 -2018
Post by: Bainford on Monday,November 09, 2020, 06:42:39 AM
Congrats to the new owner, he got a fine Europa. Hopefully he will sign up here.

Looking forward to the next project. Cheers  :beerchug: