Author Topic: Restoration of 2358R  (Read 167944 times)

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Offline buzzer

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Re: Restoration of 2358R
« Reply #555 on: Friday,February 23, 2018, 12:28:31 AM »
Just a couple of points. On pinning, it has to be done on place. The manual goes into the detail. The originals were not pre drilled. In would be very difficult to get that right.
On th lock nut and locktite . Maybe I didn’t try hard enough to make it work, but my car has a 5 speed so the joints get loaded in both directions and there is quite a resistance to engage reverse.
Dave,

Other cars. Westfield SEiW. BMW E90 Alpina D3. BMW 325 E30 convertible and Range Rover CSK

Offline surfguitar58

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Re: Restoration of 2358R
« Reply #556 on: Friday,February 23, 2018, 05:10:30 AM »
I have to say I like GavinT's steering joint approach. Designed for zero backlash and reasonably priced. The length adjustment is a problem. Drilling and pinning in place sounds like a monumental pain. Some sort of clamping means on a keyed shaft would be better than transmitting torque through a threaded/pinned connection.
Tom
"A designer knows he has achieved perfection not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away."
Antoine de Saint-Exupery

Offline Certified Lotus

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Re: Restoration of 2358R
« Reply #557 on: Saturday,February 24, 2018, 01:28:26 PM »
The Lotus shop manual also states to use loctite for the threaded studs attached to the ujoint assembly and the spherical joint. And some thing I missed before was the location of the split in the pins (they need to face the direction of the Speedo cable on the transaxle).

Tomorrow I will tackle the shift linkage job deciding between the OEM configuration and the updated version that uses RD Enterprises ujoint from Lovejoy. I’m still undecided.......but I have all the parts to go either way!

Chris is coming over so we will have an interesting conversation about the pro’s and con’s on each.

« Last Edit: Saturday,February 24, 2018, 01:37:40 PM by Certified Lotus »

Offline Certified Lotus

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Re: Restoration of 2358R
« Reply #558 on: Sunday,February 25, 2018, 02:38:35 PM »
One of the things that was on my list to go back to was installing the retaining clips for the handbrake cable. The OEM clips didn't fit the new version of the handbrake cable.  Of course I now had to install the circ clips with the chassis full of other things like water tubes, shift tube, speedo cable, oil line, etc. Never the less I persevered and got them fitted with a pair of gloves as there was no way I could get a pliers in that location.

Next was the shift tubes and decision on the type of ujoint to use.  Chris came over and we laid out both systems, discussed the pros' and cons' and decided that I would proceed with the Lovejoy ujoint system that RD Enterprises sells. New technology, more streamline and made of SS.  What the heck, sometimes you just have to roll the dice. There was more play than I wanted in the bracket that attaches to the bell housing and I replaced the aluminum end spacers with the nylon ones I got from RD.  That solved the problem. Used Loctite on the spherical joint that slides over the ujoint stud (as recommended by the shop manual). Let it cure and installed in place using the measurements in the manual regarding spacing.

Chris and I moved to Loctiting the bearings in the hub carriers and then set out to figure out how to reinstall the axle shafts.........here's where we were scratching our heads. There are flingers and very thin shims that need to be installed on the transaxle drive shafts.  The problem is the manual says nothing about this and the parts manual also show nothing.  WTF..... Who can provide an explanation of how these get installed (see photo showing how we think they go).  The odd thing is that there were no flingers or shims on my car when I disassembled it.  Same with the other Europa race car I bought, one flinger on one side and no shims, nothing on the other side.   Great mystery......

Installed the heater control valve and a few more hoses. Moved the SS hose clamps to a position that everything can be accessed from the bottom of the car (thanks Ted). 

Chris & I had a beer and called it a day. Thanks Chris!

« Last Edit: Sunday,February 25, 2018, 02:41:44 PM by Certified Lotus »

Offline BDA

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Re: Restoration of 2358R
« Reply #559 on: Sunday,February 25, 2018, 03:13:33 PM »
I never heard of any flingers. Only shims. In order to ensure there is no impact on the diff or stress on the roll pins from lateral force on the half shafts, you use the shims to ensure no lateral movement of the ujoint on the output shaft. Basically put as many shims under the u-joint as you can and still put the roll pin in through the u-joint and output shaft. You may or may not need any shims. You'll have to check them first, but I think it's likely you'll need at least a couple on at least one output shaft.

Congratulations on your progress. She's looking really pretty!  :beerchug:

Offline jbcollier

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Re: Restoration of 2358R
« Reply #560 on: Sunday,February 25, 2018, 07:17:18 PM »
 No “flingers”.

Offline EuropaTC

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Re: Restoration of 2358R
« Reply #561 on: Sunday,February 25, 2018, 11:23:40 PM »
To be fair to Certified Lotus, they are mentioned in the parts book but I don't recall them being fitted to my car when I first got it and there aren't any fitted now.

I suspect it was a carry over from the Elan rear suspension because they fitted a similar part on the inboard bearing there at around series 3, but it's called both a "guard" and "spacer" in the books. I think it's just there to deflect road spray and act as a shield for the seal on the bearing.

Offline Certified Lotus

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Re: Restoration of 2358R
« Reply #562 on: Monday,February 26, 2018, 02:28:33 AM »
Thanks for finding the page in the parts manual Brian. I thought I had seen it there before (I knew the term “flinger” had to come from somewhere) but the page I was on didn’t have it. Went back and located the page........now I know I’m not making stuff up  8)

Yes, the flinger is a dust seal, so I imagine the protruded edge goes towards the transaxle shaft as it fits inside the felt seal. Then the shims go inside of the flinger.

I’m wodering why most of you don’t have these installed?  I know when I rebuilt my S1 Elan rear diff I couldn’t fit the dust shield as the new bearings didn’t allow for the extra depth. But the new bearings already had dust shields built in so I didn’t worry. On the Europa transaxle the felt seal is definitely open to exposure of the elements. I’m going to install the flinger and see if it fits appropriately, unless someone can advise not to. It is odd the shop manual makes no mention of these,,,,,,,,
« Last Edit: Monday,February 26, 2018, 02:31:40 AM by Certified Lotus »

Offline Roger

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Re: Restoration of 2358R
« Reply #563 on: Monday,February 26, 2018, 04:04:27 AM »
My car had flingers when I stripped it, and I put them back. They fit over the stub axle where it goes into the bearing carrier, at the outboard end of the driveshaft, not the inboard where your photograph shows. The shims are on the inner end of the driveshaft as described by BDA above. I would say that fitting the flinger where you show might prevent the shims from doing their job. The bit of the parts manual posted by Brian clearly shows the flinger, item 12.
A  flinger is a device to fling oil or other lubricant away from a bearing through which it has just leaked. It was often used behind crankshaft rear main bearings to keep oil away from clutch plates, and in hub assemblies to keep it away from brake linings. Leaking oil would be flung by centrifugal force away from the bearing area.
« Last Edit: Monday,February 26, 2018, 04:08:16 AM by Roger »

Offline Certified Lotus

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Re: Restoration of 2358R
« Reply #564 on: Monday,February 26, 2018, 04:55:28 AM »
Thanks Roger, now that I’m paying closer attention to the parts drawing I see the correct location. But it doesn’t detail the orientation of the flinger. Does the protruded edge go towards the seal or towards the collar of the drive shaft?

Offline Roger

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Re: Restoration of 2358R
« Reply #565 on: Monday,February 26, 2018, 06:14:50 AM »
It goes toward the seal. If you look at the Workshop manual there's an exploded hub diagram that clearly shows it, and another diagram,  of the location of the bearing spacer,  also shows it .

Offline jbcollier

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Re: Restoration of 2358R
« Reply #566 on: Monday,February 26, 2018, 06:15:23 AM »
No flingers at the transaxle/half-shaft.  Yes, there is one on the rear wheel axle.  The protruded edge faces away from the seal -- otherwise it would rub against the seal.

Offline Roger

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Re: Restoration of 2358R
« Reply #567 on: Monday,February 26, 2018, 07:48:30 AM »
I still think the lip faces the seal, sorry!

http://www.lotus-europa.com/manuals/tcwork/d/index.htm#fig1

Look at Fig 1, and particularly Fig 5, which clearly shows the lip facing the seal.



Offline jbcollier

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Re: Restoration of 2358R
« Reply #568 on: Monday,February 26, 2018, 08:20:15 AM »
Never apologize for correcting the record!

... but I still think it faces out not in.  I think the "flinger" was only used on TC/S.  Early S1s didn't even have a seal.
« Last Edit: Monday,February 26, 2018, 01:52:48 PM by jbcollier »

Offline Certified Lotus

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Re: Restoration of 2358R
« Reply #569 on: Monday,February 26, 2018, 05:20:07 PM »
Great to have various insights and further clarification on “flingers”.  I clearly still don’t know how to read the shop manual as I keep looking in the wrong places for information.

I do worry about the lip of the flinger facing the seal as it might tear it up. But I won’t really know until I place everything next to each other and look closely to investigate further. But that will have to wait a few days while I take off for a business trip.